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[Music]

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there's a whole fleet of look on the sa

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oh my gosh they're all going against the

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it was basically a cube with inside of

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sphere where the points of the cube

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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so this isn't anything that just is

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limited to the united states it's a

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i'm lucky i only get recruitment wrong

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70 of the time but how is it we accept

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being wrong so much at a time with the

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the podcast sent you and one of their

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expert team will be in touch

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hi everyone and welcome back to that ufo

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podcast my name is andy just before i

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bring in my guest i want to say thank

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you to everyone for listening and what

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is the week of the two-year anniversary

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of the podcast confirmed already for me

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is professor gary nolan some of you may

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know that and just confirmed last week

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with me jeremy corbell will be joining

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me on the third of may for a

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conversation too so a couple of really

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big guests in me following on from the

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guest i have with me today so email any

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questions for those guests to ufo uap am

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gmail.com both of those as you can

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imagine are going to be incredibly

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popular to my guest for today's pod

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making his third appearance for an

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interview former head of the pentagon's

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atip programme mr luis elizondo welcome

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back to the podcast oh it's good to see

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you guys thank you so much and thanks to

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your uh your great audience too for

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having me and spending a little bit of

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time with us today

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it's always a very exciting conversation

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and it's one of those hopefully we can

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do it justice for the the many people

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who have sent in questions and i'm only

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sorry i couldn't have you for five or

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six hours to get through even half of

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them that have been sent over uh lou

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it's been four and a half years since

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you resigned from your role at atip and

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came forward alongside a team of others

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at two of the stars academy of arts and

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science as it was known a lot has

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happened since then and as we sit here

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now how do you reflect upon that time

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oh wow uh

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you know andy it's uh it's been

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bittersweet um you know i never wanted

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to be in a situation where i had to

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resign my position in the first place

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um but unfortunately that was uh

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that was uh the hand i was dealt and

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as i've said before you know a lot of us

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in national security take our jobs very

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seriously in fact we go to war for it

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and are willing to put our lives on the

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line for it so

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uh for me it was a very difficult um

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decision in a difficult journey but a

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decision that really was already made

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for me because a lot of people that are

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in my situation it's not just me we take

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an oath and that oath is to the american

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people and to our constitution and our

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government and whatnot

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and what it's not though is an oath to

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bureaucracy and there comes a point if

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the bureaucracy becomes uh overwhelming

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and becomes a

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hindrance an interference

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then um one has to make a decision and

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and

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there's this unwritten code of ethic

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that we have

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within national security if you can't

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fix the problem you don't make it worse

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by staying you you leave

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and

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try to fix it maybe from the outside but

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you don't want to be disruptive while on

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the inside

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that's that's

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that's not the proper way to do it so i

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did what many before me and after me

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have have done i've resigned i resigned

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my position

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as a as a matter of protest because i

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could not get the attention that was

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necessary on this topic

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at the time through my chain of command

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now i think people are seeing the rest

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of the story there were there were

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deliberate roadblocks i i actually could

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not breathe certain elements within my

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chain of command simply because of of of

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issues involving them character issues

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and other

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other issues and so what i wound up

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doing is

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taking it to the streets right

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and uh i didn't think that when i when i

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left

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it would it would have been received

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especially by the one community that was

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dying for information and transparency

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i was really surprised to see a lot of

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the the pushback if you will um and the

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disbelief initially i i'm not as you

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know i'm not a ufologist i'm not into

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ufology

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i'm just a government servant and you

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know what we did was look at ufos that's

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just the bottom line and when i came out

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and we had that conversation

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i was surprised at the amount of

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distrust people had

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uh in in that fact and i think a lot of

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it is because in the past the government

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probably wasn't transparent keep in mind

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i was relatively new to this i came into

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a tip in 2008 so a lot of the history i

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i wasn't aware of and nor did i really

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concern myself with um you know so for

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me it was whether i'm chasing terrorists

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or chasing spies or chasing ufos it's

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pretty much the same kind of job really

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uh and so um

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you know it was only later that i

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realized that there was so much distrust

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by by by the american people and by

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frankly citizens of the world

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on this topic because governments

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and i say the government's plural have

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lied about this topic for so long um and

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and

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you know i guess there's a lot of

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mistrust and so

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so that was hard and then of course uh

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after about a year or a year and a half

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um the pentagon began to to change its

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position elements within the pentagon

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after after secretary mattis jim mattis

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uh you know who i would consider you

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know an incredible human being a friend

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in fact

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um once he left they started changing

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their their position because they could

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get away with it and those individuals

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who had held a grudge against me now had

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a

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misuse

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the government apparatus for example the

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public affairs officers and

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communication channels like that

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to to try to discredit me and that was

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very very tough because i really

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affected my family very much and i

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i i couldn't just come out swinging

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there's a right way and a wrong way to

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do things so i had to bite my tongue and

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i had to

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initiate certain um efforts now people

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know the ig investigation is being one

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of them several in fact

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and try to allow the system to work and

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and while engaging you know elements

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within congress and legislative branch

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elements within the executive branch who

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knew who i was they were there when i

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was giving briefings senior very senior

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people

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um and uh you know i i had to i had to

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be very

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careful and very clever how i how i

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pursued this because they wanted to tap

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back in the back

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and so fortunately i had the help of

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people like chris mellon

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giving me advice uh other individuals

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who i won't name right now but will

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probably come out public at some point

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uh how to how to maneuver this and um

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you know it's been it's been a long it's

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been a long fight it's been been long

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and unfortunately

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it's not over um you know there's

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there's still a lot more work needs to

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be done

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um i didn't do this to to salvage or

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save my own personal credibility i did

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it to salvage the conversation about

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transparency

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and in order to do that we had to get

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the facts correct we had to get the

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pentagon to to come correct

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on their positions and unfortunately we

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had to expose a lot of the the

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contradictions that that were being made

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by that bureaucracy uh and by the way

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let me be clear i don't want to hold the

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entire pentagon or the entire department

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of defense

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responsible for that it was only a few

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individual very very powerful very well

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placed individuals

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that really were trying to obfuscate

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this this message and those individuals

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have subsequently been called out

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um you know again there's a few more i

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think uh speed bumps that that are going

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to have to be addressed and and

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potentially removed

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but we've come a long way and um

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you know as far as my

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my own personal experience i wouldn't

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have wished this on anybody

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it's been extremely difficult on my

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family um

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tough for me because i had to see the

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pain that they went through

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because they they know who

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who i am and

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what i stand for

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and to see the constant attacks and to

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see that the pentagon was favoring

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certain media outlets to you know push

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their agenda and their information and

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it was obvious the problem it wasn't

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obvious to to to to the public um you

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know for some folks it was i think and

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you know you're starting to see now

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articles coming out by individuals uh

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who have a really good understanding of

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what was going on but those voices were

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the minority for a long time and um i

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think

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yeah i mean there you have it it's been

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a really tough journey for me personally

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and for my family

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just for context i've tried to split

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this interview up to past present and

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future so if there's anything people may

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be listening to thinking follow up on

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00:10:10,710 --> 00:10:08,399
that it may come later down the line

280
00:10:12,310 --> 00:10:10,720
depending on how it goes uh i want to

281
00:10:14,630 --> 00:10:12,320
ask you lu now

282
00:10:16,470 --> 00:10:14,640
i want to try and make this fair i i get

283
00:10:18,389 --> 00:10:16,480
called out for being a fan of yours and

284
00:10:20,310 --> 00:10:18,399
whatever that might may entail and i

285
00:10:22,470 --> 00:10:20,320
i've said yeah i put my eggs in luella's

286
00:10:24,470 --> 00:10:22,480
ondo basket at the moment you know and i

287
00:10:26,470 --> 00:10:24,480
was a fan of ttsa and what they set out

288
00:10:28,550 --> 00:10:26,480
to accomplish and what was accomplished

289
00:10:30,389 --> 00:10:28,560
but i think it's fair to say that you

290
00:10:32,310 --> 00:10:30,399
are human and you've always said that

291
00:10:33,509 --> 00:10:32,320
and along the lines you will have made

292
00:10:35,430 --> 00:10:33,519
mistakes

293
00:10:37,590 --> 00:10:35,440
what is the biggest mistake you've made

294
00:10:39,509 --> 00:10:37,600
or or misstep you've taken since leaving

295
00:10:41,269 --> 00:10:39,519
ate it and what wow

296
00:10:43,269 --> 00:10:41,279
uh you know andy i think the biggest

297
00:10:45,509 --> 00:10:43,279
mistake i've made is one that i haven't

298
00:10:47,190 --> 00:10:45,519
been able to recognize yet because if i

299
00:10:49,269 --> 00:10:47,200
don't recognize a mistake then i can't

300
00:10:51,030 --> 00:10:49,279
fix it and i can't address it and i'm

301
00:10:52,230 --> 00:10:51,040
sure i've made a lot you know i've made

302
00:10:55,110 --> 00:10:52,240
a lot of mistakes and i try to hold

303
00:10:56,630 --> 00:10:55,120
myself accountable and and very quickly

304
00:10:58,710 --> 00:10:56,640
address it if i say something that's

305
00:11:01,750 --> 00:10:58,720
contradictory or i say something that

306
00:11:03,430 --> 00:11:01,760
that later on turns out to be to be

307
00:11:05,509 --> 00:11:03,440
inaccurate because it's either my

308
00:11:07,670 --> 00:11:05,519
opinion or the way i i i read the

309
00:11:09,670 --> 00:11:07,680
information um i i always try to hold

310
00:11:11,670 --> 00:11:09,680
myself accountable my i guess my biggest

311
00:11:13,590 --> 00:11:11,680
fear or my my greatest

312
00:11:15,190 --> 00:11:13,600
mistake or those mistakes that i've made

313
00:11:16,710 --> 00:11:15,200
i haven't recognized they haven't

314
00:11:19,990 --> 00:11:16,720
brought my been brought to my attention

315
00:11:21,590 --> 00:11:20,000
yet so i i i'm unaware of them right and

316
00:11:23,110 --> 00:11:21,600
i'm very careful because a lot of people

317
00:11:25,190 --> 00:11:23,120
hold on to every word that i say and

318
00:11:27,509 --> 00:11:25,200
i've i've been very clear i i leave

319
00:11:29,030 --> 00:11:27,519
breadcrumbs in some cases you know

320
00:11:30,150 --> 00:11:29,040
loads of bread along the way for people

321
00:11:31,110 --> 00:11:30,160
to follow

322
00:11:33,750 --> 00:11:31,120
um

323
00:11:35,350 --> 00:11:33,760
but if i've made a mistake and and it

324
00:11:37,030 --> 00:11:35,360
hasn't been brought to my attention or

325
00:11:38,949 --> 00:11:37,040
i'm unaware of it then

326
00:11:40,870 --> 00:11:38,959
that's that's that's truly the biggest

327
00:11:42,790 --> 00:11:40,880
mistake because because it can't be

328
00:11:44,710 --> 00:11:42,800
fixed right it can't be fixed until it's

329
00:11:46,710 --> 00:11:44,720
it's it's it's

330
00:11:47,990 --> 00:11:46,720
made me brought to my attention i made

331
00:11:49,750 --> 00:11:48,000
aware of it so

332
00:11:53,350 --> 00:11:49,760
um i guess it's the mistakes that i

333
00:11:55,430 --> 00:11:53,360
don't i don't realize i've made yet

334
00:11:57,590 --> 00:11:55,440
in your last jimmy church interview now

335
00:11:59,990 --> 00:11:57,600
we started arranging this during your

336
00:12:01,829 --> 00:12:00,000
media run announcement back in february

337
00:12:03,509 --> 00:12:01,839
um you said at that time you just come

338
00:12:05,430 --> 00:12:03,519
back from one of the most successful

339
00:12:08,629 --> 00:12:05,440
ever visits from dc

340
00:12:11,430 --> 00:12:08,639
um what makes a successful visit in this

341
00:12:13,269 --> 00:12:11,440
you know in this topic in dc and i want

342
00:12:16,069 --> 00:12:13,279
to know as well i'm a fan of the west

343
00:12:17,670 --> 00:12:16,079
wing tv show and i remember at one

344
00:12:19,350 --> 00:12:17,680
moment of an episode where they they

345
00:12:22,230 --> 00:12:19,360
said at the start the previous

346
00:12:23,990 --> 00:12:22,240
administration had almost cured cancer

347
00:12:25,990 --> 00:12:24,000
and they used that as a let's go cure

348
00:12:28,790 --> 00:12:26,000
cancer let's go and do that big thing

349
00:12:30,790 --> 00:12:28,800
did you have any nearly moments in dc

350
00:12:32,629 --> 00:12:30,800
where we almost got

351
00:12:34,389 --> 00:12:32,639
a level of progress that we don't have

352
00:12:35,269 --> 00:12:34,399
yet and for whatever reason it didn't

353
00:12:36,069 --> 00:12:35,279
happen

354
00:12:39,110 --> 00:12:36,079
yeah

355
00:12:43,509 --> 00:12:39,120
uh wow what an insightful question

356
00:12:45,590 --> 00:12:43,519
um every trip to dc is successful um

357
00:12:46,629 --> 00:12:45,600
you know it depends it depends who we're

358
00:12:48,629 --> 00:12:46,639
engaging

359
00:12:50,470 --> 00:12:48,639
um there's always new information to be

360
00:12:52,629 --> 00:12:50,480
discussed and new developments and new

361
00:12:54,949 --> 00:12:52,639
incidents new data

362
00:12:56,710 --> 00:12:54,959
but then there's also the conversation

363
00:12:58,069 --> 00:12:56,720
of where do we go from here right and

364
00:13:01,030 --> 00:12:58,079
when when

365
00:13:02,870 --> 00:13:01,040
when people are having a healthy debate

366
00:13:04,389 --> 00:13:02,880
on what are the next steps

367
00:13:06,069 --> 00:13:04,399
that's fantastic because that means

368
00:13:06,949 --> 00:13:06,079
people are thinking about the right

369
00:13:10,710 --> 00:13:06,959
things

370
00:13:12,629 --> 00:13:10,720
um as far as a almost moment

371
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:12,639
yeah there's there's one in particular

372
00:13:17,110 --> 00:13:14,240
but unfortunately i'm not at liberty to

373
00:13:19,829 --> 00:13:17,120
discuss it yet um it occurred some time

374
00:13:22,150 --> 00:13:19,839
ago some colleagues were involved in it

375
00:13:24,550 --> 00:13:22,160
there was a discussion by by some very

376
00:13:27,110 --> 00:13:24,560
senior people in a former administration

377
00:13:31,190 --> 00:13:27,120
to potentially

378
00:13:32,949 --> 00:13:31,200
discuss disclosure um

379
00:13:35,030 --> 00:13:32,959
and for whatever reasons it was decided

380
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:35,040
later on not you know maybe it wasn't it

381
00:13:38,790 --> 00:13:37,200
wasn't time um

382
00:13:41,350 --> 00:13:38,800
i i wasn't privy to that i don't know

383
00:13:42,870 --> 00:13:41,360
all the details and i certainly

384
00:13:44,629 --> 00:13:42,880
you know it's preliminary right now for

385
00:13:46,310 --> 00:13:44,639
me to even comment on it

386
00:13:48,710 --> 00:13:46,320
uh but there have been those moments

387
00:13:49,829 --> 00:13:48,720
where where we've come very close to

388
00:13:52,550 --> 00:13:49,839
something

389
00:13:54,790 --> 00:13:52,560
and um you know for for whatever reason

390
00:13:55,910 --> 00:13:54,800
it was decided uh that maybe the timing

391
00:13:56,710 --> 00:13:55,920
wasn't right

392
00:13:58,230 --> 00:13:56,720
um

393
00:13:59,189 --> 00:13:58,240
but again i want to be very careful

394
00:14:01,430 --> 00:13:59,199
because i

395
00:14:03,509 --> 00:14:01,440
i'm hearing this third hand

396
00:14:06,310 --> 00:14:03,519
so i don't wanna

397
00:14:07,750 --> 00:14:06,320
i don't wanna say too much um

398
00:14:10,790 --> 00:14:07,760
because

399
00:14:11,670 --> 00:14:10,800
you know i wasn't there

400
00:14:13,990 --> 00:14:11,680
and

401
00:14:16,710 --> 00:14:14,000
can you talk about any realizations

402
00:14:18,710 --> 00:14:16,720
during or after moments during your time

403
00:14:20,470 --> 00:14:18,720
in atip it's no secret with your

404
00:14:22,310 --> 00:14:20,480
clearance you would have been privy to

405
00:14:24,470 --> 00:14:22,320
to some of those videos or pieces of

406
00:14:26,550 --> 00:14:24,480
footage or the data some of us would

407
00:14:27,750 --> 00:14:26,560
love to see and we hear about we hear

408
00:14:30,629 --> 00:14:27,760
talked about

409
00:14:32,629 --> 00:14:30,639
you must have sat back and just went wow

410
00:14:34,470 --> 00:14:32,639
and just had a moment whether it was in

411
00:14:37,110 --> 00:14:34,480
an office or in a car or can you talk

412
00:14:39,430 --> 00:14:37,120
about any of those yeah i mean i always

413
00:14:41,430 --> 00:14:39,440
reference a 23-minute video that that's

414
00:14:42,949 --> 00:14:41,440
a very compelling video at some point if

415
00:14:44,870 --> 00:14:42,959
it comes out people are gonna go holy

416
00:14:46,790 --> 00:14:44,880
smokes but that's not just the only one

417
00:14:48,550 --> 00:14:46,800
there's i mean people

418
00:14:51,750 --> 00:14:48,560
i've said this before let me let me if i

419
00:14:54,230 --> 00:14:51,760
can maybe re-emphasize it

420
00:14:55,670 --> 00:14:54,240
this is happening every week guys

421
00:14:57,269 --> 00:14:55,680
this is every this is not i mean if

422
00:14:58,870 --> 00:14:57,279
you're focusing on the name it's not you

423
00:15:00,470 --> 00:14:58,880
but people are focusing just on an image

424
00:15:01,829 --> 00:15:00,480
of the roosevelt

425
00:15:04,069 --> 00:15:01,839
you're focusing on the wrong things

426
00:15:05,910 --> 00:15:04,079
because this is happening every week

427
00:15:07,590 --> 00:15:05,920
data's coming in

428
00:15:10,069 --> 00:15:07,600
from all over

429
00:15:11,750 --> 00:15:10,079
the world from from u.s collection

430
00:15:12,790 --> 00:15:11,760
assets and again i want to be careful to

431
00:15:13,910 --> 00:15:12,800
say what i

432
00:15:15,670 --> 00:15:13,920
you know

433
00:15:17,670 --> 00:15:15,680
what i say here but

434
00:15:18,470 --> 00:15:17,680
but this is happening every week

435
00:15:20,230 --> 00:15:18,480
um

436
00:15:22,870 --> 00:15:20,240
and more and more people are coming out

437
00:15:24,069 --> 00:15:22,880
and and reporting these incidents and

438
00:15:25,829 --> 00:15:24,079
capturing

439
00:15:28,550 --> 00:15:25,839
video and and

440
00:15:29,509 --> 00:15:28,560
telemetry data and whatnot so

441
00:15:31,430 --> 00:15:29,519
um

442
00:15:34,310 --> 00:15:31,440
you know it's hard to say you know was

443
00:15:37,030 --> 00:15:34,320
there a moment because every moment

444
00:15:37,910 --> 00:15:37,040
every time you think you you you've seen

445
00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:37,920
you know

446
00:15:42,150 --> 00:15:40,639
the ultimate video then then more data

447
00:15:43,269 --> 00:15:42,160
more information comes out and there's

448
00:15:44,550 --> 00:15:43,279
another one right and then there's

449
00:15:46,550 --> 00:15:44,560
another one there's another one there's

450
00:15:48,150 --> 00:15:46,560
a pilot coming and saying look i chased

451
00:15:50,790 --> 00:15:48,160
the thing for half an hour i couldn't

452
00:15:51,829 --> 00:15:50,800
get close to it you know i mean it's it

453
00:15:53,990 --> 00:15:51,839
so there

454
00:15:56,870 --> 00:15:54,000
there's not just one compelling video

455
00:15:59,030 --> 00:15:56,880
there's there's a lot of

456
00:16:01,430 --> 00:15:59,040
data out there that's continuing to come

457
00:16:04,790 --> 00:16:01,440
to to fruition uh

458
00:16:08,790 --> 00:16:06,550
regarding the efforts and the policies

459
00:16:11,430 --> 00:16:08,800
that have recently been put in place for

460
00:16:13,430 --> 00:16:11,440
that information to be reported um you

461
00:16:15,030 --> 00:16:13,440
know there was a hope that that

462
00:16:16,310 --> 00:16:15,040
increased reporting would occur and

463
00:16:20,230 --> 00:16:16,320
again like i said that's coming to

464
00:16:24,230 --> 00:16:22,470
over time you mentioned pilots chasing

465
00:16:25,430 --> 00:16:24,240
these objects for up to half an hour or

466
00:16:27,110 --> 00:16:25,440
longer and

467
00:16:29,509 --> 00:16:27,120
back in the tic-tac event that's been

468
00:16:31,269 --> 00:16:29,519
talked about ad nauseam um that they

469
00:16:33,189 --> 00:16:31,279
were they were they're hovering for

470
00:16:35,269 --> 00:16:33,199
hours and you know 12 hours at a time

471
00:16:37,430 --> 00:16:35,279
which we just don't have that technology

472
00:16:39,030 --> 00:16:37,440
has there been any data presented to

473
00:16:42,870 --> 00:16:39,040
yourself you can talk about that we've

474
00:16:45,350 --> 00:16:42,880
noticed that the technology of these uap

475
00:16:47,590 --> 00:16:45,360
have improved over time you've mentioned

476
00:16:49,269 --> 00:16:47,600
that going back to the 50s and 60s we've

477
00:16:51,829 --> 00:16:49,279
seen these objects but

478
00:16:54,710 --> 00:16:51,839
is there any notable difference now

479
00:16:56,710 --> 00:16:54,720
no um it seems to be the same technology

480
00:16:58,470 --> 00:16:56,720
being displayed i mean we have radar

481
00:17:00,550 --> 00:16:58,480
tracks and radar data these things doing

482
00:17:02,550 --> 00:17:00,560
upwards of 13 000 miles an hour in low

483
00:17:05,029 --> 00:17:02,560
earth atmosphere where the friction

484
00:17:08,630 --> 00:17:05,039
coefficient of that is is

485
00:17:11,189 --> 00:17:08,640
is is astounding it's it's almost like

486
00:17:12,870 --> 00:17:11,199
it'd be like swimming through dirt uh

487
00:17:14,630 --> 00:17:12,880
it's just the air is so thick and when

488
00:17:16,789 --> 00:17:14,640
you're moving that fast you know air

489
00:17:18,949 --> 00:17:16,799
density and air friction is is

490
00:17:21,789 --> 00:17:18,959
problematic that's the reason why

491
00:17:25,750 --> 00:17:21,799
case in point the sr-71 lockheed

492
00:17:28,309 --> 00:17:25,760
v12asr71 the blackbird um it is it is an

493
00:17:31,830 --> 00:17:28,319
aircraft comprised entirely of titanium

494
00:17:34,870 --> 00:17:31,840
um because it it gets superheated even

495
00:17:36,710 --> 00:17:34,880
though it's flying at you know

496
00:17:38,789 --> 00:17:36,720
many tens of thousands of feet in

497
00:17:40,470 --> 00:17:38,799
altitude and traveling at three three

498
00:17:42,150 --> 00:17:40,480
thousand five three thousand two hundred

499
00:17:44,830 --> 00:17:42,160
miles an hour

500
00:17:47,909 --> 00:17:44,840
um the friction is so

501
00:17:49,830 --> 00:17:47,919
high that on some of the colder parts of

502
00:17:52,310 --> 00:17:49,840
the engine it's still like

503
00:17:54,870 --> 00:17:52,320
800 900 degrees

504
00:17:56,070 --> 00:17:54,880
so and that's at 3 200 miles an hour

505
00:17:58,870 --> 00:17:56,080
imagine

506
00:18:00,630 --> 00:17:58,880
you know speeds

507
00:18:03,350 --> 00:18:00,640
several times faster

508
00:18:04,870 --> 00:18:03,360
um it's it's almost unimaginable almost

509
00:18:07,750 --> 00:18:04,880
incomprehensible

510
00:18:09,510 --> 00:18:07,760
and you know the sr-71 is it's very very

511
00:18:11,029 --> 00:18:09,520
high when it it's flying like that with

512
00:18:12,950 --> 00:18:11,039
that that

513
00:18:15,110 --> 00:18:12,960
that amount of heat

514
00:18:17,590 --> 00:18:15,120
you know the lower you go in atmosphere

515
00:18:19,510 --> 00:18:17,600
it just that that friction coefficient

516
00:18:21,750 --> 00:18:19,520
just goes up and up and up

517
00:18:23,669 --> 00:18:21,760
and we we have historical data going

518
00:18:25,510 --> 00:18:23,679
back to the 50s where the theme 60 where

519
00:18:28,230 --> 00:18:25,520
they think we're track doing

520
00:18:29,430 --> 00:18:28,240
eight nine ten thousand miles an hour so

521
00:18:31,590 --> 00:18:29,440
um

522
00:18:35,909 --> 00:18:31,600
you know i i don't think

523
00:18:36,950 --> 00:18:35,919
we have seen a a a if you will a

524
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:36,960
steady

525
00:18:41,510 --> 00:18:38,880
increase in their capabilities the

526
00:18:44,950 --> 00:18:41,520
capabilities seem to be the same what we

527
00:18:47,830 --> 00:18:44,960
do see is a increased prevalence

528
00:18:49,350 --> 00:18:47,840
of these things being seen

529
00:18:51,110 --> 00:18:49,360
and we don't know if that's a function

530
00:18:52,310 --> 00:18:51,120
of simply technology everybody now has a

531
00:18:55,590 --> 00:18:52,320
cell phone

532
00:18:57,029 --> 00:18:55,600
uh the world is more densely populated

533
00:18:58,630 --> 00:18:57,039
it could be or it could be that there

534
00:19:00,310 --> 00:18:58,640
really is an increased prevalence we

535
00:19:04,230 --> 00:19:00,320
don't know yet um you know there's

536
00:19:06,870 --> 00:19:04,240
there's data to suggest both may be true

537
00:19:08,230 --> 00:19:06,880
and on that data the line is now famous

538
00:19:09,430 --> 00:19:08,240
there's a whole fleet of them look on

539
00:19:11,270 --> 00:19:09,440
the essay

540
00:19:13,909 --> 00:19:11,280
can you tell us how often there were

541
00:19:16,150 --> 00:19:13,919
multiple uaps reported compared to an

542
00:19:18,950 --> 00:19:16,160
individual craft was it a pattern

543
00:19:21,590 --> 00:19:18,960
recognized or any takeaway from that

544
00:19:22,710 --> 00:19:21,600
well they were flying in a v formation

545
00:19:27,350 --> 00:19:22,720
um

546
00:19:29,430 --> 00:19:27,360
more of these things were trapped and

547
00:19:30,470 --> 00:19:29,440
actually seen with the naked eye

548
00:19:32,310 --> 00:19:30,480
um

549
00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:32,320
you know they're they're

550
00:19:36,870 --> 00:19:34,080
it's interesting because some of the

551
00:19:39,029 --> 00:19:36,880
historical videos that have described a

552
00:19:40,950 --> 00:19:39,039
triangular vehicle

553
00:19:43,590 --> 00:19:40,960
um you know the problem is when you're

554
00:19:45,110 --> 00:19:43,600
looking at a blank sky and you see three

555
00:19:47,110 --> 00:19:45,120
points of light there's no reference

556
00:19:48,630 --> 00:19:47,120
there's no depth and the question is are

557
00:19:50,230 --> 00:19:48,640
you actually is there an object in the

558
00:19:52,630 --> 00:19:50,240
middle is there a solid object in the

559
00:19:55,510 --> 00:19:52,640
middle or is it really three separate

560
00:19:56,870 --> 00:19:55,520
you know vehicles so to speak uh or

561
00:19:59,830 --> 00:19:56,880
points of light

562
00:20:02,149 --> 00:19:59,840
and uh you know orientation also

563
00:20:04,390 --> 00:20:02,159
means means a lot and so

564
00:20:07,190 --> 00:20:04,400
it's difficult we have seen cases where

565
00:20:09,430 --> 00:20:07,200
we thought we saw uh

566
00:20:11,110 --> 00:20:09,440
some some material between if you will a

567
00:20:13,350 --> 00:20:11,120
triangular craft and it turned out later

568
00:20:15,430 --> 00:20:13,360
that it was actually three separate uap

569
00:20:17,350 --> 00:20:15,440
and then other cases it turns out where

570
00:20:19,190 --> 00:20:17,360
you think we see three separate uap and

571
00:20:20,710 --> 00:20:19,200
it's actually part of a

572
00:20:21,990 --> 00:20:20,720
single vehicle

573
00:20:24,070 --> 00:20:22,000
um

574
00:20:26,870 --> 00:20:24,080
and so you know i i think it's probably

575
00:20:28,710 --> 00:20:26,880
too early to tell right now um

576
00:20:30,630 --> 00:20:28,720
you know is there is there a greater

577
00:20:31,669 --> 00:20:30,640
frequency of of

578
00:20:33,750 --> 00:20:31,679
um

579
00:20:35,430 --> 00:20:33,760
vehicles flying in formation and are

580
00:20:37,909 --> 00:20:35,440
they do they accompany

581
00:20:40,070 --> 00:20:37,919
uh other uap certainly that that that

582
00:20:43,029 --> 00:20:40,080
has happened there's a lot of data that

583
00:20:44,789 --> 00:20:43,039
suggests sometimes they fly together

584
00:20:46,070 --> 00:20:44,799
it looks like

585
00:20:48,390 --> 00:20:46,080
some of these things are actually kicked

586
00:20:50,070 --> 00:20:48,400
off almost like a think of a drone or a

587
00:20:51,669 --> 00:20:50,080
uav coming from a mother ship if you

588
00:20:53,510 --> 00:20:51,679
will i hate to use that term but you

589
00:20:55,750 --> 00:20:53,520
know from up from a larger vehicle a

590
00:20:57,909 --> 00:20:55,760
larger craft um

591
00:21:00,630 --> 00:20:57,919
i i think it's you know i don't know if

592
00:21:03,990 --> 00:21:00,640
there's been any real analysis to make a

593
00:21:06,870 --> 00:21:04,000
determination that um you know

594
00:21:08,710 --> 00:21:06,880
most uap incidents involve a fleet of

595
00:21:10,390 --> 00:21:08,720
them right as we heard as you're talking

596
00:21:11,270 --> 00:21:10,400
about the famous video look on the asa

597
00:21:12,070 --> 00:21:11,280
right

598
00:21:13,990 --> 00:21:12,080
um

599
00:21:16,390 --> 00:21:14,000
i don't i don't know i i i do know that

600
00:21:18,789 --> 00:21:16,400
that there's there's data on both both

601
00:21:21,510 --> 00:21:18,799
singular craft and and multiple vehicles

602
00:21:22,870 --> 00:21:21,520
being being seen and and and interacting

603
00:21:23,990 --> 00:21:22,880
with each other to some degree you know

604
00:21:25,029 --> 00:21:24,000
it goes back

605
00:21:26,630 --> 00:21:25,039
it's interesting there's some old

606
00:21:28,870 --> 00:21:26,640
historical reporting

607
00:21:30,789 --> 00:21:28,880
uh from the uh

608
00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:30,799
from right before the the beginning of

609
00:21:33,990 --> 00:21:33,039
the renaissance uh during the the middle

610
00:21:37,190 --> 00:21:34,000
ages

611
00:21:39,350 --> 00:21:37,200
uh in 1600's actually so in in nuremberg

612
00:21:40,950 --> 00:21:39,360
uh the famous nuremberg incident in

613
00:21:42,870 --> 00:21:40,960
germany where

614
00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:42,880
a lot of different shaped vehicles

615
00:21:48,789 --> 00:21:45,600
lenticular craft and cylindrical crafts

616
00:21:50,390 --> 00:21:48,799
triangular craft little orbs of light

617
00:21:51,990 --> 00:21:50,400
seem to be interacting with each other

618
00:21:54,310 --> 00:21:52,000
and some even describe it that there was

619
00:21:57,190 --> 00:21:54,320
some sort of aerial dog fight

620
00:21:59,430 --> 00:21:57,200
between between vehicles

621
00:22:01,750 --> 00:21:59,440
obviously this is centuries before my

622
00:22:03,750 --> 00:22:01,760
time so i i certainly can't speak uh in

623
00:22:05,510 --> 00:22:03,760
an articulate manner uh regarding that

624
00:22:07,590 --> 00:22:05,520
incident but you know there were there

625
00:22:09,830 --> 00:22:07,600
were a lot of eyewitnesses that that

626
00:22:12,149 --> 00:22:09,840
that that discussed that uh of these

627
00:22:14,390 --> 00:22:12,159
these vehicles flying in formation if

628
00:22:16,149 --> 00:22:14,400
you will

629
00:22:18,149 --> 00:22:16,159
you mentioned an increase in sightings

630
00:22:20,789 --> 00:22:18,159
you know is that down to us having more

631
00:22:22,870 --> 00:22:20,799
more cell phones or navy technologies

632
00:22:24,870 --> 00:22:22,880
military technology improving month on

633
00:22:28,710 --> 00:22:24,880
month maybe week on week

634
00:22:30,549 --> 00:22:28,720
are they noticing us noticing them more

635
00:22:33,350 --> 00:22:30,559
well they certainly are aware that that

636
00:22:34,870 --> 00:22:33,360
we are now aware um you know dave fravor

637
00:22:37,510 --> 00:22:34,880
actually talks about as he goes to

638
00:22:39,029 --> 00:22:37,520
engage and cut the gap uh and try to

639
00:22:41,350 --> 00:22:39,039
engage this tic tac

640
00:22:43,430 --> 00:22:41,360
it orientated itself at him pointed at

641
00:22:45,510 --> 00:22:43,440
him and and kept a safe distance from

642
00:22:48,630 --> 00:22:45,520
his aircraft and and kind of mirrored

643
00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:48,640
his maneuvers uh in order to to to keep

644
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:51,360
a safe distance uh and then you know

645
00:22:55,830 --> 00:22:54,000
bang as he starts to close a gap it

646
00:22:58,950 --> 00:22:55,840
it then demonstrates that it's not it's

647
00:23:01,909 --> 00:22:58,960
not very happy with dave framer so uh it

648
00:23:02,789 --> 00:23:01,919
it disappears over the horizon um

649
00:23:04,710 --> 00:23:02,799
you know

650
00:23:07,270 --> 00:23:04,720
there does seem to be some sort of

651
00:23:09,190 --> 00:23:07,280
awareness there it's not like um you

652
00:23:10,789 --> 00:23:09,200
know we're walking uh in the desert

653
00:23:13,350 --> 00:23:10,799
there's you know we don't notice the

654
00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:13,360
ants on the floor um that they it

655
00:23:17,669 --> 00:23:14,960
definitely seems that they are very well

656
00:23:19,750 --> 00:23:17,679
aware of our presence uh and and and

657
00:23:21,270 --> 00:23:19,760
respond accordingly um

658
00:23:23,750 --> 00:23:21,280
you know

659
00:23:26,149 --> 00:23:23,760
people talk about communication but

660
00:23:27,590 --> 00:23:26,159
you know when i when i when i take a

661
00:23:29,990 --> 00:23:27,600
treat and i tell my dog to sit and the

662
00:23:31,590 --> 00:23:30,000
dog sits you know i'm training the dog

663
00:23:33,029 --> 00:23:31,600
but at the same time the dog is trained

664
00:23:34,789 --> 00:23:33,039
mean when the dog

665
00:23:36,390 --> 00:23:34,799
you know whines and wants to go outside

666
00:23:37,669 --> 00:23:36,400
the dog has trained me to go open the

667
00:23:39,990 --> 00:23:37,679
door because he needs to go to the

668
00:23:42,630 --> 00:23:40,000
bathroom right so it's

669
00:23:45,590 --> 00:23:42,640
communication doesn't have to be verbal

670
00:23:47,590 --> 00:23:45,600
and you know one can surmise that you

671
00:23:49,830 --> 00:23:47,600
know by us doing certain things and it

672
00:23:52,710 --> 00:23:49,840
responds accordingly that's a form of

673
00:23:53,750 --> 00:23:52,720
communication and you know it we do see

674
00:23:55,830 --> 00:23:53,760
that there's an interest to keen

675
00:23:58,070 --> 00:23:55,840
interest in our nuclear equities

676
00:24:00,310 --> 00:23:58,080
um

677
00:24:02,630 --> 00:24:00,320
so anyways there there you have it i i

678
00:24:04,470 --> 00:24:02,640
think it's um

679
00:24:06,710 --> 00:24:04,480
i think there's definitely an awareness

680
00:24:09,350 --> 00:24:06,720
of of of our presence that's that's

681
00:24:10,950 --> 00:24:09,360
pretty clear

682
00:24:12,870 --> 00:24:10,960
dave ravers incident has been well

683
00:24:14,789 --> 00:24:12,880
documented and commander favor talked

684
00:24:16,950 --> 00:24:14,799
about it on several shows

685
00:24:19,510 --> 00:24:16,960
have you spoken to other pilots who have

686
00:24:21,669 --> 00:24:19,520
had incidents as spectacular as that

687
00:24:23,350 --> 00:24:21,679
that of course and how they described

688
00:24:25,669 --> 00:24:23,360
very similar behaviors or anything

689
00:24:26,789 --> 00:24:25,679
different yeah absolutely both similar

690
00:24:28,870 --> 00:24:26,799
and different

691
00:24:30,870 --> 00:24:28,880
um it's you know it's really an enigma

692
00:24:32,390 --> 00:24:30,880
um there's pilots who have tried to

693
00:24:35,029 --> 00:24:32,400
engage it there's there's a pilot i

694
00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:35,039
spoke to in south america whoever had

695
00:24:38,070 --> 00:24:36,640
like a thousand eyewitnesses they were

696
00:24:41,110 --> 00:24:38,080
doing a formation on the air on the

697
00:24:43,430 --> 00:24:41,120
tarmac and and there was this uap over

698
00:24:44,470 --> 00:24:43,440
the the air base so they scrambled one

699
00:24:46,789 --> 00:24:44,480
of the at the time one of the most

700
00:24:49,190 --> 00:24:46,799
premier fighter aircraft russian fighter

701
00:24:51,909 --> 00:24:49,200
aircraft to to to engage this thing

702
00:24:54,310 --> 00:24:51,919
and uh you know he fired his his cannons

703
00:24:56,950 --> 00:24:54,320
at it and uh you know it didn't it

704
00:24:58,070 --> 00:24:56,960
didn't do a damn thing um

705
00:25:00,230 --> 00:24:58,080
you know there's there's other ones

706
00:25:02,070 --> 00:25:00,240
where these things will come in uh you

707
00:25:03,909 --> 00:25:02,080
know right next to the aircraft right

708
00:25:05,990 --> 00:25:03,919
off the wing tip and just kind of

709
00:25:07,909 --> 00:25:06,000
almost like almost like it's

710
00:25:09,909 --> 00:25:07,919
unbelievable almost like like

711
00:25:11,909 --> 00:25:09,919
fly as a wingman for a while almost like

712
00:25:13,350 --> 00:25:11,919
like play with the pilot you know almost

713
00:25:15,029 --> 00:25:13,360
you know

714
00:25:16,710 --> 00:25:15,039
i hate to say playful way because we

715
00:25:18,470 --> 00:25:16,720
really don't know but

716
00:25:20,789 --> 00:25:18,480
but there doesn't seem to be any obvious

717
00:25:22,630 --> 00:25:20,799
signs of aggression uh almost kind of

718
00:25:24,230 --> 00:25:22,640
like hey you know let's go play and let

719
00:25:26,230 --> 00:25:24,240
me let me let me show you what i can do

720
00:25:29,350 --> 00:25:26,240
right um

721
00:25:30,950 --> 00:25:29,360
so that's that's been reported as well

722
00:25:33,029 --> 00:25:30,960
it sounds like dolphins when they swim

723
00:25:34,789 --> 00:25:33,039
alongside boats

724
00:25:36,470 --> 00:25:34,799
and maneuvers and they just go off and

725
00:25:38,950 --> 00:25:36,480
do their own thing yeah they ride the

726
00:25:40,870 --> 00:25:38,960
the bow wave right and uh you know

727
00:25:42,870 --> 00:25:40,880
they'll kind of demonstrate look look

728
00:25:44,470 --> 00:25:42,880
how maneuverable i am in the water right

729
00:25:46,870 --> 00:25:44,480
flip and turn and spin and you know here

730
00:25:48,950 --> 00:25:46,880
you are just plowing through the waves

731
00:25:50,950 --> 00:25:48,960
um yeah that's that's a good that's a

732
00:25:52,710 --> 00:25:50,960
good analogy

733
00:25:54,390 --> 00:25:52,720
you mentioned interestingly uh going

734
00:25:57,190 --> 00:25:54,400
back to the past different shapes of

735
00:25:59,110 --> 00:25:57,200
craft lenticular and such and excuse a

736
00:26:00,950 --> 00:25:59,120
slightly longer question here

737
00:26:03,430 --> 00:26:00,960
part of the recently declassified but

738
00:26:06,470 --> 00:26:03,440
heavily redacted uap task force report

739
00:26:08,149 --> 00:26:06,480
contained a page on the shape of uap

740
00:26:10,230 --> 00:26:08,159
tic tacs seem to have replaced the

741
00:26:12,230 --> 00:26:10,240
classic saucer shape in terms of the

742
00:26:14,549 --> 00:26:12,240
go-to descriptor that you see online

743
00:26:16,870 --> 00:26:14,559
from from people these days however to

744
00:26:19,190 --> 00:26:16,880
your knowledge are the us military and

745
00:26:22,390 --> 00:26:19,200
others still encountering a range of

746
00:26:25,269 --> 00:26:22,400
shaped craft that are categorically

747
00:26:28,149 --> 00:26:25,279
not adversarial technologies

748
00:26:31,909 --> 00:26:29,909
you're asking me two different questions

749
00:26:33,350 --> 00:26:31,919
actually uh you're asking me are they

750
00:26:36,230 --> 00:26:33,360
still encountering different shapes

751
00:26:38,870 --> 00:26:36,240
craft yes absolutely it's not just tic

752
00:26:41,350 --> 00:26:38,880
tacs um but the second part of your

753
00:26:42,950 --> 00:26:41,360
question is you know are

754
00:26:45,110 --> 00:26:42,960
are they certainly not

755
00:26:47,029 --> 00:26:45,120
uh adversarial technology what i can say

756
00:26:49,190 --> 00:26:47,039
is we think that they're not adversarial

757
00:26:53,110 --> 00:26:49,200
technology you don't know what you don't

758
00:26:54,870 --> 00:26:53,120
know um it's highly unlikely that that

759
00:26:57,269 --> 00:26:54,880
that some of these are foreign

760
00:26:59,590 --> 00:26:57,279
technology but as we continue to evolve

761
00:27:01,110 --> 00:26:59,600
technologically speaking we're getting

762
00:27:03,750 --> 00:27:01,120
more and more advanced in our in our

763
00:27:05,909 --> 00:27:03,760
capabilities and so at some point we may

764
00:27:07,590 --> 00:27:05,919
find ourselves in a situation where some

765
00:27:10,230 --> 00:27:07,600
of these uap could absolutely be

766
00:27:12,710 --> 00:27:10,240
replicated by a foreign government

767
00:27:14,310 --> 00:27:12,720
um i i don't think we're there yet and i

768
00:27:16,390 --> 00:27:14,320
think that the general consensus by the

769
00:27:17,669 --> 00:27:16,400
intelligence communities that we're not

770
00:27:19,830 --> 00:27:17,679
there yet

771
00:27:21,669 --> 00:27:19,840
but but at some point the more we

772
00:27:23,110 --> 00:27:21,679
understand and learn about these things

773
00:27:26,310 --> 00:27:23,120
the more we may have the ability to

774
00:27:28,149 --> 00:27:26,320
replicate some of their performance

775
00:27:30,070 --> 00:27:28,159
and your answer would that be the reason

776
00:27:33,029 --> 00:27:30,080
or one of the reasons that that page is

777
00:27:35,110 --> 00:27:33,039
so heavily redacted is because if

778
00:27:36,789 --> 00:27:35,120
if the us government show that we know

779
00:27:37,990 --> 00:27:36,799
there's this shape this shape and this

780
00:27:40,070 --> 00:27:38,000
shape and it turns out those are

781
00:27:42,149 --> 00:27:40,080
actually chinese drones you don't want

782
00:27:43,029 --> 00:27:42,159
the chinese to know that you know they

783
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:43,039
have

784
00:27:47,909 --> 00:27:44,880
precisely you know you don't you don't

785
00:27:49,510 --> 00:27:47,919
ever want to broadcast your your your

786
00:27:51,110 --> 00:27:49,520
vulnerabilities and you also don't want

787
00:27:54,070 --> 00:27:51,120
to broadcast what you know about your

788
00:27:55,430 --> 00:27:54,080
enemy um you know that's that's

789
00:27:56,789 --> 00:27:55,440
that's very important it's part of

790
00:27:58,950 --> 00:27:56,799
counterintelligence you don't you don't

791
00:28:00,470 --> 00:27:58,960
want to reveal playing a game of chess

792
00:28:02,549 --> 00:28:00,480
you don't want to tell your enemy what

793
00:28:04,070 --> 00:28:02,559
your next move is and you don't want to

794
00:28:06,630 --> 00:28:04,080
tell your enemy what your own pieces are

795
00:28:09,350 --> 00:28:06,640
capable of um that's that's not a very

796
00:28:10,549 --> 00:28:09,360
smart way to play play play chess

797
00:28:11,510 --> 00:28:10,559
um

798
00:28:13,190 --> 00:28:11,520
so you're

799
00:28:14,950 --> 00:28:13,200
you're absolutely correct that's that's

800
00:28:17,669 --> 00:28:14,960
one certainly one reason to keep things

801
00:28:19,269 --> 00:28:17,679
classified

802
00:28:22,070 --> 00:28:19,279
any other reasons if that's one of them

803
00:28:23,909 --> 00:28:22,080
that you could go into yeah i mean

804
00:28:26,789 --> 00:28:23,919
we could spend here all day talking

805
00:28:28,549 --> 00:28:26,799
about why we classify information

806
00:28:29,990 --> 00:28:28,559
you know usually particularly i suppose

807
00:28:32,149 --> 00:28:30,000
the shape sorry i should i should have

808
00:28:33,750 --> 00:28:32,159
give you context here the the actual

809
00:28:35,590 --> 00:28:33,760
shape of the objects why would that be

810
00:28:37,110 --> 00:28:35,600
classified

811
00:28:39,190 --> 00:28:37,120
um you know there's something called

812
00:28:41,590 --> 00:28:39,200
blue force and red force capabilities

813
00:28:43,029 --> 00:28:41,600
blue force uh are are considered your

814
00:28:44,389 --> 00:28:43,039
own technologies

815
00:28:46,789 --> 00:28:44,399
red force are considered the

816
00:28:48,549 --> 00:28:46,799
technologies of your adversaries

817
00:28:50,549 --> 00:28:48,559
you know we spend billions of dollars

818
00:28:52,149 --> 00:28:50,559
each year in research and development

819
00:28:54,149 --> 00:28:52,159
trying to keep a competitive advantage

820
00:28:56,230 --> 00:28:54,159
over our adversaries

821
00:28:58,310 --> 00:28:56,240
you know we we do have some very

822
00:29:00,789 --> 00:28:58,320
sophisticated technologies that i'm

823
00:29:02,470 --> 00:29:00,799
certainly not going to go into

824
00:29:03,590 --> 00:29:02,480
and you want to protect those equities

825
00:29:06,149 --> 00:29:03,600
you know

826
00:29:07,350 --> 00:29:06,159
is it possible

827
00:29:09,990 --> 00:29:07,360
in the past that some people have

828
00:29:12,710 --> 00:29:10,000
confused ufos with with

829
00:29:14,630 --> 00:29:12,720
advanced secret u.s technology well sure

830
00:29:16,549 --> 00:29:14,640
we know that that happened with the with

831
00:29:18,549 --> 00:29:16,559
the b2 bomber program people would

832
00:29:20,789 --> 00:29:18,559
report the the black flying wing that

833
00:29:24,149 --> 00:29:20,799
you know and also the the old wobbly

834
00:29:25,669 --> 00:29:24,159
goblin the f you know the 117 uh the

835
00:29:27,669 --> 00:29:25,679
night knight fighter

836
00:29:29,269 --> 00:29:27,679
um you know people

837
00:29:31,029 --> 00:29:29,279
people often look like we even see it

838
00:29:33,430 --> 00:29:31,039
right now in in the commercial world

839
00:29:34,549 --> 00:29:33,440
right with with with elon musk and

840
00:29:36,470 --> 00:29:34,559
starling

841
00:29:37,990 --> 00:29:36,480
people you know see these chains of

842
00:29:39,590 --> 00:29:38,000
satellites i see them all the time out

843
00:29:42,789 --> 00:29:39,600
here in wyoming that this chain of

844
00:29:44,470 --> 00:29:42,799
satellites 50 60 long in a string almost

845
00:29:47,029 --> 00:29:44,480
like a string of pearls and

846
00:29:48,630 --> 00:29:47,039
people report that as being ufos because

847
00:29:50,470 --> 00:29:48,640
if you've never seen it before then

848
00:29:52,310 --> 00:29:50,480
certainly it's going to be it's going to

849
00:29:53,830 --> 00:29:52,320
be something that's going to be novel

850
00:29:55,590 --> 00:29:53,840
and it's going to pique your interest

851
00:29:57,269 --> 00:29:55,600
and and you know it may seem like an

852
00:29:59,269 --> 00:29:57,279
unidentified flying object when in

853
00:30:00,870 --> 00:29:59,279
reality it's it's just a new type of

854
00:30:02,630 --> 00:30:00,880
technology

855
00:30:04,710 --> 00:30:02,640
the government wants to protect a lot of

856
00:30:06,710 --> 00:30:04,720
those key technologies not not starling

857
00:30:08,870 --> 00:30:06,720
necessarily but but other technologies

858
00:30:10,310 --> 00:30:08,880
that we we employ and develop because we

859
00:30:12,230 --> 00:30:10,320
spend a lot of money on it right and we

860
00:30:14,630 --> 00:30:12,240
don't want an adversary coming in and

861
00:30:16,789 --> 00:30:14,640
stealing it and then you know having

862
00:30:19,190 --> 00:30:16,799
that same that same advantage on the

863
00:30:21,269 --> 00:30:19,200
battle space so there's all sorts of

864
00:30:22,710 --> 00:30:21,279
reasons uh again i mean we could spend

865
00:30:25,029 --> 00:30:22,720
here probably the next three hours if

866
00:30:27,110 --> 00:30:25,039
you really wanted to talk about it but

867
00:30:29,669 --> 00:30:27,120
you know there's there's good reason why

868
00:30:32,149 --> 00:30:29,679
why even the shapes of vehicles may may

869
00:30:33,990 --> 00:30:32,159
wind up being redacted uh because a

870
00:30:35,750 --> 00:30:34,000
shape can tell you a lot you know let's

871
00:30:37,269 --> 00:30:35,760
let's let's look at this little aircraft

872
00:30:39,990 --> 00:30:37,279
here for a moment right

873
00:30:42,470 --> 00:30:40,000
um if i were to show you this

874
00:30:45,110 --> 00:30:42,480
and compare this to let's say the model

875
00:30:46,549 --> 00:30:45,120
of a biplane right well just by looking

876
00:30:48,630 --> 00:30:46,559
at the shape of this this probably tells

877
00:30:50,470 --> 00:30:48,640
you a whole lot right you have a delta

878
00:30:54,389 --> 00:30:50,480
lean configuration

879
00:30:55,669 --> 00:30:54,399
um small uh control surfaces so you can

880
00:30:58,070 --> 00:30:55,679
assume this is probably going to fly

881
00:30:59,669 --> 00:30:58,080
very very fast when you look at the

882
00:31:01,269 --> 00:30:59,679
intakes the intakes are on top of the

883
00:31:02,230 --> 00:31:01,279
aircraft on top of the airframe not

884
00:31:03,990 --> 00:31:02,240
below

885
00:31:06,389 --> 00:31:04,000
so that probably tells you that this

886
00:31:09,190 --> 00:31:06,399
this is a vehicle that is designed to to

887
00:31:11,750 --> 00:31:09,200
have a low signature you know you you

888
00:31:13,909 --> 00:31:11,760
can tell a lot by by simple shape you

889
00:31:17,430 --> 00:31:13,919
know and um you know this is just a

890
00:31:18,710 --> 00:31:17,440
little little toy right so

891
00:31:20,870 --> 00:31:18,720
so yeah there's there's reasons why you

892
00:31:22,950 --> 00:31:20,880
want to keep certain things classified

893
00:31:24,389 --> 00:31:22,960
and and shapes can tell you a lot they

894
00:31:26,630 --> 00:31:24,399
can tell you physical characteristics

895
00:31:28,710 --> 00:31:26,640
and even performance capabilities and

896
00:31:30,950 --> 00:31:28,720
potentially even uh you know something

897
00:31:32,549 --> 00:31:30,960
manned or unmanned um

898
00:31:34,470 --> 00:31:32,559
so yeah

899
00:31:36,710 --> 00:31:34,480
there you have it

900
00:31:38,870 --> 00:31:36,720
uh and last year on some interviews you

901
00:31:41,110 --> 00:31:38,880
mentioned china was potentially going to

902
00:31:42,149 --> 00:31:41,120
attempt to raise the uep issue within

903
00:31:43,430 --> 00:31:42,159
the u.n

904
00:31:45,269 --> 00:31:43,440
is that something that is still

905
00:31:46,470 --> 00:31:45,279
progressing that you can speak about

906
00:31:48,470 --> 00:31:46,480
well they did

907
00:31:50,710 --> 00:31:48,480
um they did it was called the five

908
00:31:53,029 --> 00:31:50,720
continents initiative and uh they were

909
00:31:56,389 --> 00:31:53,039
behind that and it uh

910
00:31:58,549 --> 00:31:56,399
did not go i think as planned uh i think

911
00:32:00,870 --> 00:31:58,559
people became very wise very quickly as

912
00:32:02,549 --> 00:32:00,880
to to you know we you don't want one

913
00:32:04,630 --> 00:32:02,559
nation controlling the narrative and

914
00:32:06,870 --> 00:32:04,640
that includes the united states you know

915
00:32:08,710 --> 00:32:06,880
this is something that impacts everyone

916
00:32:10,470 --> 00:32:08,720
i think everybody should have have have

917
00:32:12,470 --> 00:32:10,480
an equal say

918
00:32:14,310 --> 00:32:12,480
in this topic uh from a governmental

919
00:32:16,789 --> 00:32:14,320
perspective and this is why we've tried

920
00:32:19,669 --> 00:32:16,799
to to what i've said before

921
00:32:21,190 --> 00:32:19,679
democratize the conversation um you know

922
00:32:22,630 --> 00:32:21,200
the problem for the last 70 years is

923
00:32:23,830 --> 00:32:22,640
that we haven't democratized the

924
00:32:26,830 --> 00:32:23,840
conversation

925
00:32:29,029 --> 00:32:26,840
it's been held in small enclaves of

926
00:32:31,350 --> 00:32:29,039
organizations and institutions

927
00:32:34,149 --> 00:32:31,360
uh and governments and that hasn't been

928
00:32:35,190 --> 00:32:34,159
very helpful towards transparency so

929
00:32:36,870 --> 00:32:35,200
so

930
00:32:38,710 --> 00:32:36,880
we are trying to democratize the

931
00:32:40,630 --> 00:32:38,720
conversation and i think the united

932
00:32:42,710 --> 00:32:40,640
nations is certainly someplace that

933
00:32:44,310 --> 00:32:42,720
would be very

934
00:32:46,470 --> 00:32:44,320
good to have this conversation on the

935
00:32:48,789 --> 00:32:46,480
international level furthermore there's

936
00:32:51,590 --> 00:32:48,799
efforts we see with italy right now and

937
00:32:53,990 --> 00:32:51,600
and the small republic of san marino by

938
00:32:56,230 --> 00:32:54,000
the way the longest-standing republic uh

939
00:32:57,350 --> 00:32:56,240
in the entire world since the 1300s i

940
00:32:59,509 --> 00:32:57,360
had the honor and privilege of going

941
00:33:01,830 --> 00:32:59,519
there and speaking to some members of of

942
00:33:03,909 --> 00:33:01,840
of the government of san marino you know

943
00:33:07,190 --> 00:33:03,919
and and maybe having a small enclave

944
00:33:11,029 --> 00:33:07,200
like that would be great to to you know

945
00:33:12,710 --> 00:33:11,039
have a an annual uh u.n meeting

946
00:33:14,230 --> 00:33:12,720
on on um

947
00:33:16,149 --> 00:33:14,240
on this topic you know there was an

948
00:33:18,310 --> 00:33:16,159
initiative called the titan

949
00:33:19,909 --> 00:33:18,320
titan is the name of the mountain there

950
00:33:20,950 --> 00:33:19,919
san marino

951
00:33:25,430 --> 00:33:20,960
and

952
00:33:27,029 --> 00:33:25,440
titan was chosen as a name to to

953
00:33:29,590 --> 00:33:27,039
perhaps

954
00:33:31,750 --> 00:33:29,600
try and get the rest of the world on

955
00:33:33,509 --> 00:33:31,760
board with having a summit if you will

956
00:33:35,190 --> 00:33:33,519
the international summit on the on the

957
00:33:37,190 --> 00:33:35,200
uap topic

958
00:33:38,710 --> 00:33:37,200
hosted there by san marino

959
00:33:40,630 --> 00:33:38,720
san marino's a neutral country they

960
00:33:42,870 --> 00:33:40,640
haven't even even during the world war

961
00:33:44,310 --> 00:33:42,880
ii um you know it's a bit of a

962
00:33:46,310 --> 00:33:44,320
switzerland

963
00:33:48,789 --> 00:33:46,320
and uh you know there there's there

964
00:33:50,549 --> 00:33:48,799
seems to be some interest and and i for

965
00:33:53,750 --> 00:33:50,559
one think it's a great idea you know so

966
00:33:56,470 --> 00:33:53,760
i i think international uh involvement

967
00:33:57,509 --> 00:33:56,480
is critical um i don't think that china

968
00:34:02,310 --> 00:33:57,519
should be

969
00:34:04,389 --> 00:34:02,320
leaving the effort you know it's i'm not

970
00:34:05,990 --> 00:34:04,399
i'm not trying to offend anybody

971
00:34:07,750 --> 00:34:06,000
you know it's from china what i'm simply

972
00:34:09,190 --> 00:34:07,760
saying is that that no one country

973
00:34:12,069 --> 00:34:09,200
should should own the narrative or

974
00:34:13,510 --> 00:34:12,079
control the narrative

975
00:34:15,349 --> 00:34:13,520
louie i'm going to move on to discuss

976
00:34:16,869 --> 00:34:15,359
the present so we've covered the past

977
00:34:19,270 --> 00:34:16,879
there quite well i think and appreciate

978
00:34:20,869 --> 00:34:19,280
the answers um you

979
00:34:23,109 --> 00:34:20,879
of course i'm going to discuss gary reid

980
00:34:25,430 --> 00:34:23,119
however i would point people to ryan

981
00:34:27,990 --> 00:34:25,440
robbins if you search ufo jesus on

982
00:34:29,829 --> 00:34:28,000
youtube done a 37 minute interview which

983
00:34:31,750 --> 00:34:29,839
dropped on the 22nd of april which

984
00:34:33,190 --> 00:34:31,760
covers that that situation in quite a

985
00:34:34,869 --> 00:34:33,200
lot of detail and covers it quite well

986
00:34:36,710 --> 00:34:34,879
lou and i'll put the links for that in

987
00:34:38,869 --> 00:34:36,720
the description however i do want to

988
00:34:41,669 --> 00:34:38,879
know um you stated on that interview

989
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:41,679
that gary reed made progress on the uap

990
00:34:45,750 --> 00:34:43,200
topic difficult

991
00:34:47,430 --> 00:34:45,760
is the road now clearer for others who

992
00:34:49,030 --> 00:34:47,440
are on the side of progress within the

993
00:34:51,270 --> 00:34:49,040
government to come forward

994
00:34:53,030 --> 00:34:51,280
or is this a hydra type situation where

995
00:34:54,389 --> 00:34:53,040
you cut off one head and two more will

996
00:34:56,230 --> 00:34:54,399
take its place

997
00:34:57,750 --> 00:34:56,240
no i think it certainly made it easier

998
00:34:59,030 --> 00:34:57,760
the problem is that in the government

999
00:35:01,750 --> 00:34:59,040
there's still elements that don't

1000
00:35:04,470 --> 00:35:01,760
appreciate the topic they they consider

1001
00:35:07,190 --> 00:35:04,480
they consider this issue of uap as as an

1002
00:35:08,470 --> 00:35:07,200
issue of air clutter and space trash

1003
00:35:10,150 --> 00:35:08,480
space junk

1004
00:35:12,310 --> 00:35:10,160
and you know with the hopes of well if

1005
00:35:14,310 --> 00:35:12,320
we can identify more air cluttered space

1006
00:35:18,310 --> 00:35:14,320
junk then we can you know put this to

1007
00:35:20,870 --> 00:35:18,320
bed and and ufos are are are not real um

1008
00:35:24,230 --> 00:35:20,880
that's not the case ufos are represent

1009
00:35:26,310 --> 00:35:24,240
breakaway technology ufos uap

1010
00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:26,320
are it represents breakaway technology

1011
00:35:30,230 --> 00:35:28,160
it's not it's not a matter of air trash

1012
00:35:31,829 --> 00:35:30,240
yes we have air trash out there and we

1013
00:35:33,829 --> 00:35:31,839
have clutter there's you know there's

1014
00:35:34,950 --> 00:35:33,839
laws that require u.s air domain

1015
00:35:36,150 --> 00:35:34,960
awareness but those laws have been

1016
00:35:37,670 --> 00:35:36,160
around forever i mean they've been

1017
00:35:39,829 --> 00:35:37,680
around for a long long time especially

1018
00:35:41,349 --> 00:35:39,839
after 9 11 there was really an increased

1019
00:35:42,790 --> 00:35:41,359
emphasis on trying to figure out what's

1020
00:35:44,870 --> 00:35:42,800
in our airspace

1021
00:35:47,109 --> 00:35:44,880
but don't lump don't make the mistake of

1022
00:35:49,270 --> 00:35:47,119
lumping uap which represents something

1023
00:35:51,829 --> 00:35:49,280
completely different as an air clutter

1024
00:35:53,510 --> 00:35:51,839
issue or an air trash issue that that

1025
00:35:55,510 --> 00:35:53,520
that's a mistake and so

1026
00:35:57,670 --> 00:35:55,520
you know trying to have that discussion

1027
00:35:59,349 --> 00:35:57,680
with with bureaucrats who don't they

1028
00:36:00,870 --> 00:35:59,359
just don't get it right and they just

1029
00:36:02,230 --> 00:36:00,880
they want this monkey off their back and

1030
00:36:03,990 --> 00:36:02,240
they want to answer

1031
00:36:06,710 --> 00:36:04,000
answer congress and scratch that it's

1032
00:36:08,630 --> 00:36:06,720
they can move on to do other things

1033
00:36:10,310 --> 00:36:08,640
that's that's not gonna happen

1034
00:36:11,990 --> 00:36:10,320
and and i i you know i don't know how to

1035
00:36:15,190 --> 00:36:12,000
tell people politely who are still in

1036
00:36:16,150 --> 00:36:15,200
these positions of power and influence

1037
00:36:19,750 --> 00:36:16,160
but

1038
00:36:21,670 --> 00:36:19,760
you're not meeting the intent of

1039
00:36:24,230 --> 00:36:21,680
congress if you think that you're going

1040
00:36:27,589 --> 00:36:24,240
to wrap this up as air clutter issue

1041
00:36:28,950 --> 00:36:27,599
uh or space junk then um you know you

1042
00:36:30,390 --> 00:36:28,960
you you probably need to start looking

1043
00:36:32,630 --> 00:36:30,400
for another job at some point because

1044
00:36:34,310 --> 00:36:32,640
that's that's not the intent of congress

1045
00:36:35,829 --> 00:36:34,320
and and it's um

1046
00:36:38,870 --> 00:36:35,839
it's not the intent of the american

1047
00:36:40,870 --> 00:36:38,880
people certainly and so um that's you

1048
00:36:43,030 --> 00:36:40,880
know that's that's one of the concerns i

1049
00:36:45,430 --> 00:36:43,040
have right now and and making sure that

1050
00:36:46,870 --> 00:36:45,440
people remain informed and educated

1051
00:36:49,349 --> 00:36:46,880
about this topic

1052
00:36:51,349 --> 00:36:49,359
um you know it's complex and people want

1053
00:36:53,349 --> 00:36:51,359
to know and you know the ufo hobbyist

1054
00:36:55,750 --> 00:36:53,359
out there you know doesn't really

1055
00:36:57,750 --> 00:36:55,760
necessarily appreciate all the nuances

1056
00:36:59,270 --> 00:36:57,760
what's going on right now i mean this is

1057
00:37:01,190 --> 00:36:59,280
this is we're still in a fight we're

1058
00:37:02,950 --> 00:37:01,200
still in a battle we we won a

1059
00:37:05,510 --> 00:37:02,960
significant battle but the war is not

1060
00:37:06,390 --> 00:37:05,520
over uh regarding transparency in this

1061
00:37:09,589 --> 00:37:06,400
topic

1062
00:37:11,990 --> 00:37:09,599
it's it's hard fought every single day

1063
00:37:13,750 --> 00:37:12,000
we are engaged in trying to get this

1064
00:37:15,430 --> 00:37:13,760
topic elevated

1065
00:37:17,270 --> 00:37:15,440
where it needs to be elevated and having

1066
00:37:18,870 --> 00:37:17,280
the intent of congress met because

1067
00:37:20,550 --> 00:37:18,880
ultimately the intent of congress is the

1068
00:37:21,990 --> 00:37:20,560
intent of the american people they work

1069
00:37:24,630 --> 00:37:22,000
for their constituents their

1070
00:37:25,670 --> 00:37:24,640
constituents have spoken we want this

1071
00:37:28,310 --> 00:37:25,680
addressed

1072
00:37:29,670 --> 00:37:28,320
so so anybody who is in the executive

1073
00:37:32,230 --> 00:37:29,680
branch who thinks that you know

1074
00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:32,240
addressing this as just you know

1075
00:37:35,990 --> 00:37:34,160
air clutter and air trash you're not

1076
00:37:38,310 --> 00:37:36,000
you're not meeting the will and the

1077
00:37:39,589 --> 00:37:38,320
intent of the american people ultimately

1078
00:37:41,589 --> 00:37:39,599
and and that's a problem because your

1079
00:37:43,109 --> 00:37:41,599
job is to serve the american people you

1080
00:37:43,829 --> 00:37:43,119
know and so that's why i say look you

1081
00:37:47,589 --> 00:37:43,839
know

1082
00:37:50,630 --> 00:37:47,599
i i'm trying to be polite but but

1083
00:37:52,390 --> 00:37:50,640
you don't want to make that mistake

1084
00:37:54,230 --> 00:37:52,400
please look look at look at what's just

1085
00:37:55,510 --> 00:37:54,240
happened you know if you you're not

1086
00:37:57,109 --> 00:37:55,520
serving the intent of the american

1087
00:37:58,630 --> 00:37:57,119
people then then

1088
00:38:00,950 --> 00:37:58,640
chances are you're not going to last

1089
00:38:03,270 --> 00:38:00,960
very long in the government because

1090
00:38:04,630 --> 00:38:03,280
people are now wise to this topic

1091
00:38:06,470 --> 00:38:04,640
and i'm not going to get let you get

1092
00:38:08,069 --> 00:38:06,480
away with just obfuscation

1093
00:38:09,750 --> 00:38:08,079
that's that's not going to occur

1094
00:38:11,750 --> 00:38:09,760
certainly not why

1095
00:38:13,510 --> 00:38:11,760
while people like me and chris mellon

1096
00:38:15,829 --> 00:38:13,520
are alive that's

1097
00:38:18,470 --> 00:38:15,839
we we have no problem uh

1098
00:38:20,710 --> 00:38:18,480
there's a vernacular calling i guess in

1099
00:38:22,790 --> 00:38:20,720
cards calling the spade spade right uh

1100
00:38:24,069 --> 00:38:22,800
in in in cards

1101
00:38:25,829 --> 00:38:24,079
um

1102
00:38:28,550 --> 00:38:25,839
we have no problem doing that

1103
00:38:29,750 --> 00:38:28,560
it's it's um i have no problem

1104
00:38:31,030 --> 00:38:29,760
addressing

1105
00:38:33,190 --> 00:38:31,040
um

1106
00:38:37,109 --> 00:38:33,200
malfeasance uh i have no problem

1107
00:38:37,990 --> 00:38:37,119
addressing uh ineptitude and corruptness

1108
00:38:40,150 --> 00:38:38,000
uh

1109
00:38:42,310 --> 00:38:40,160
i'm not i'm not i'm not at all

1110
00:38:44,069 --> 00:38:42,320
opposed to uh calling people out on that

1111
00:38:46,150 --> 00:38:44,079
on on national tv

1112
00:38:48,310 --> 00:38:46,160
in the media because ultimately we have

1113
00:38:50,710 --> 00:38:48,320
to hold these people accountable their

1114
00:38:51,990 --> 00:38:50,720
job is to to to

1115
00:38:54,870 --> 00:38:52,000
in essence

1116
00:38:57,109 --> 00:38:54,880
um represent the will of the people

1117
00:38:57,990 --> 00:38:57,119
and and to execute the will of the

1118
00:39:00,950 --> 00:38:58,000
people

1119
00:39:02,950 --> 00:39:00,960
and uh if they don't do that then you

1120
00:39:05,910 --> 00:39:02,960
know again probably better better better

1121
00:39:07,750 --> 00:39:05,920
off finding another job

1122
00:39:09,430 --> 00:39:07,760
many of those people you talk about who

1123
00:39:11,910 --> 00:39:09,440
have an interest in the subject are

1124
00:39:14,550 --> 00:39:11,920
eagerly awaiting the the next video to

1125
00:39:16,150 --> 00:39:14,560
hopefully be declassified or leaked or

1126
00:39:18,310 --> 00:39:16,160
dropped someone to

1127
00:39:19,910 --> 00:39:18,320
show us the famous photographs that you

1128
00:39:21,829 --> 00:39:19,920
know black triangles whatever they may

1129
00:39:24,550 --> 00:39:21,839
be whether they really exist or not

1130
00:39:27,270 --> 00:39:24,560
something that is coming as your book

1131
00:39:29,910 --> 00:39:27,280
and uh is that finished yet

1132
00:39:31,349 --> 00:39:29,920
i am i am working very diligently on it

1133
00:39:33,829 --> 00:39:31,359
um

1134
00:39:35,990 --> 00:39:33,839
i'm definitely progressing quite well

1135
00:39:37,750 --> 00:39:36,000
with it um i want to be very careful you

1136
00:39:39,910 --> 00:39:37,760
know always manage expectations i'd

1137
00:39:40,710 --> 00:39:39,920
rather under promise and over deliver if

1138
00:39:43,109 --> 00:39:40,720
uh

1139
00:39:45,349 --> 00:39:43,119
if i if i have my choice but i know that

1140
00:39:48,870 --> 00:39:45,359
it is it is coming along quite well

1141
00:39:51,349 --> 00:39:48,880
uh i'm working on it um

1142
00:39:53,109 --> 00:39:51,359
very diligently and i i think it's going

1143
00:39:56,950 --> 00:39:53,119
to be very uh

1144
00:39:58,550 --> 00:39:56,960
informative when it when it comes out

1145
00:40:01,430 --> 00:39:58,560
is it a book that you want to write or

1146
00:40:03,510 --> 00:40:01,440
is it a book that you need to write

1147
00:40:05,829 --> 00:40:03,520
uh it's a book i need to write

1148
00:40:07,750 --> 00:40:05,839
um no it's it's a lot of work i don't

1149
00:40:09,109 --> 00:40:07,760
want to write the book it needs to be

1150
00:40:10,630 --> 00:40:09,119
written because people need to know the

1151
00:40:11,750 --> 00:40:10,640
truth because once you write that book

1152
00:40:13,270 --> 00:40:11,760
and it's in writing it can never be

1153
00:40:15,829 --> 00:40:13,280
taken away

1154
00:40:17,510 --> 00:40:15,839
and that is you know think of a slide

1155
00:40:19,190 --> 00:40:17,520
rule right

1156
00:40:21,670 --> 00:40:19,200
you know

1157
00:40:23,510 --> 00:40:21,680
i want to make a point

1158
00:40:25,109 --> 00:40:23,520
using this book where we can never go

1159
00:40:26,790 --> 00:40:25,119
backwards in time

1160
00:40:27,910 --> 00:40:26,800
you'll never be able you might slow

1161
00:40:30,390 --> 00:40:27,920
progress

1162
00:40:32,309 --> 00:40:30,400
uh if you are uh you know in charge of

1163
00:40:33,990 --> 00:40:32,319
this effort but you'll never be able to

1164
00:40:35,510 --> 00:40:34,000
put it back the genie back in the bottle

1165
00:40:36,630 --> 00:40:35,520
because the book will be definitive and

1166
00:40:39,430 --> 00:40:36,640
it's going to say

1167
00:40:41,109 --> 00:40:39,440
this is what happened and this is what's

1168
00:40:42,790 --> 00:40:41,119
happening and these are the facts and

1169
00:40:46,550 --> 00:40:42,800
then at that point

1170
00:40:49,109 --> 00:40:46,560
you know people can use that as as

1171
00:40:51,990 --> 00:40:49,119
hopefully a a new starting point for

1172
00:40:54,069 --> 00:40:52,000
this conversation

1173
00:40:55,109 --> 00:40:54,079
what's been the hardest part of writing

1174
00:40:56,230 --> 00:40:55,119
the book

1175
00:40:57,829 --> 00:40:56,240
wow

1176
00:40:58,710 --> 00:40:57,839
uh you know you can only put so much in

1177
00:40:59,589 --> 00:40:58,720
a book

1178
00:41:02,069 --> 00:40:59,599
yeah

1179
00:41:04,069 --> 00:41:02,079
um you can only put you know 300 show

1180
00:41:06,950 --> 00:41:04,079
pages i mean i i could put a thousand

1181
00:41:08,230 --> 00:41:06,960
pages 2 000 pages in this so it's the

1182
00:41:09,990 --> 00:41:08,240
hardest part is probably figuring out

1183
00:41:11,349 --> 00:41:10,000
what what you have to leave out but you

1184
00:41:13,270 --> 00:41:11,359
have to cut out

1185
00:41:15,430 --> 00:41:13,280
um just because there's so much

1186
00:41:17,750 --> 00:41:15,440
information that that's available this

1187
00:41:19,510 --> 00:41:17,760
is this is still i mean this this is

1188
00:41:21,190 --> 00:41:19,520
still the book's writing itself right

1189
00:41:23,030 --> 00:41:21,200
now i mean it's it's still evolving

1190
00:41:24,309 --> 00:41:23,040
right because every day there's new

1191
00:41:25,349 --> 00:41:24,319
information and new things that are

1192
00:41:27,750 --> 00:41:25,359
happening

1193
00:41:29,430 --> 00:41:27,760
um that that you know have to be in the

1194
00:41:30,870 --> 00:41:29,440
book and i guess you know the biggest

1195
00:41:33,030 --> 00:41:30,880
concern is i had the book and all of a

1196
00:41:34,870 --> 00:41:33,040
sudden it comes out but you know during

1197
00:41:36,069 --> 00:41:34,880
that time it's being published there's

1198
00:41:38,230 --> 00:41:36,079
more information that really should be

1199
00:41:39,510 --> 00:41:38,240
in the book so

1200
00:41:40,950 --> 00:41:39,520
it's kind of uh

1201
00:41:43,030 --> 00:41:40,960
you know um

1202
00:41:45,030 --> 00:41:43,040
it's a bit of a frustration because it's

1203
00:41:45,910 --> 00:41:45,040
it's this topic is evolving so quickly

1204
00:41:48,550 --> 00:41:45,920
now

1205
00:41:50,069 --> 00:41:48,560
that uh it's it's it's it's it's almost

1206
00:41:52,069 --> 00:41:50,079
impossible to make the determination

1207
00:41:53,750 --> 00:41:52,079
okay what you know do i put this in and

1208
00:41:55,670 --> 00:41:53,760
leave this out or do i put

1209
00:41:56,790 --> 00:41:55,680
that in and leave this out right and

1210
00:41:58,069 --> 00:41:56,800
it's uh

1211
00:42:04,150 --> 00:41:58,079
it's

1212
00:42:05,670 --> 00:42:04,160
for the discussion

1213
00:42:07,349 --> 00:42:05,680
the things that you do leave out are

1214
00:42:09,750 --> 00:42:07,359
what people like me will ask you when

1215
00:42:11,990 --> 00:42:09,760
you come to talk about the work on shows

1216
00:42:15,270 --> 00:42:12,000
in the future um one of those shows that

1217
00:42:17,670 --> 00:42:15,280
people ask about is joe rogan now

1218
00:42:19,270 --> 00:42:17,680
chris mellon has been on joe rogan dave

1219
00:42:20,230 --> 00:42:19,280
fraver has been on joe rogan george

1220
00:42:23,349 --> 00:42:20,240
knapp

1221
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:23,359
you as of yet are still uh conspicuous

1222
00:42:26,870 --> 00:42:24,880
by your absence

1223
00:42:28,470 --> 00:42:26,880
has that been something that has been

1224
00:42:30,870 --> 00:42:28,480
planned and never happened or is it

1225
00:42:32,309 --> 00:42:30,880
something that's in the future for you

1226
00:42:34,230 --> 00:42:32,319
i don't think about it

1227
00:42:36,950 --> 00:42:34,240
um you know i'm not i'm not a hollywood

1228
00:42:39,510 --> 00:42:36,960
guy i'm not i'm not a i'm not somebody

1229
00:42:41,750 --> 00:42:39,520
that seeks attention uh or wants to be

1230
00:42:43,190 --> 00:42:41,760
seen every time i'm on mainstream media

1231
00:42:45,109 --> 00:42:43,200
because they ask me to be on it i don't

1232
00:42:46,790 --> 00:42:45,119
go out and say hey put me on tv you know

1233
00:42:48,870 --> 00:42:46,800
i'm not that guy

1234
00:42:51,109 --> 00:42:48,880
um i really frankly don't give a damn if

1235
00:42:52,150 --> 00:42:51,119
i'm on someone's podcast or not um to me

1236
00:42:54,390 --> 00:42:52,160
it's not a

1237
00:42:55,750 --> 00:42:54,400
uh you know i know exactly who i am i

1238
00:42:58,470 --> 00:42:55,760
don't need that validation or

1239
00:43:00,309 --> 00:42:58,480
vindication to be on any team i've

1240
00:43:01,670 --> 00:43:00,319
always been lou elizondo no he will be

1241
00:43:03,910 --> 00:43:01,680
louis

1242
00:43:05,910 --> 00:43:03,920
um i don't think about it

1243
00:43:08,150 --> 00:43:05,920
to my knowledge joe rogan hasn't asked

1244
00:43:10,230 --> 00:43:08,160
me and frankly i haven't reached out to

1245
00:43:11,910 --> 00:43:10,240
him and asked him

1246
00:43:13,190 --> 00:43:11,920
i figure if he wants me on the show

1247
00:43:15,750 --> 00:43:13,200
he'll ask me

1248
00:43:17,910 --> 00:43:15,760
and i'll consider it um but i don't need

1249
00:43:19,670 --> 00:43:17,920
to be on anybody's show for example i'm

1250
00:43:21,349 --> 00:43:19,680
doing this with you you know i'm doing

1251
00:43:23,750 --> 00:43:21,359
this because you asked me i didn't come

1252
00:43:25,270 --> 00:43:23,760
out to ask you can i be on your podcast

1253
00:43:26,390 --> 00:43:25,280
and i don't give a name if you have one

1254
00:43:28,550 --> 00:43:26,400
follower or

1255
00:43:30,309 --> 00:43:28,560
one billion followers you know if you

1256
00:43:32,550 --> 00:43:30,319
ask me to be on your program and you're

1257
00:43:34,950 --> 00:43:32,560
a decent dial i'm happy to do it you

1258
00:43:36,309 --> 00:43:34,960
know you're a decent person so

1259
00:43:37,990 --> 00:43:36,319
um

1260
00:43:39,510 --> 00:43:38,000
yeah i mean that's

1261
00:43:41,670 --> 00:43:39,520
short and simple he hasn't asked me and

1262
00:43:44,710 --> 00:43:41,680
and frankly i haven't

1263
00:43:46,710 --> 00:43:44,720
i haven't really asked him either

1264
00:43:48,470 --> 00:43:46,720
the benefit for people like myself is i

1265
00:43:51,190 --> 00:43:48,480
get so many listeners tell me that they

1266
00:43:52,950 --> 00:43:51,200
found me because they saw you or dave

1267
00:43:55,670 --> 00:43:52,960
fravor or another or any of those of

1268
00:43:58,150 --> 00:43:55,680
those people who speak on ufos on you

1269
00:44:00,470 --> 00:43:58,160
know joe rogan's podcast or kojai mango

1270
00:44:03,349 --> 00:44:00,480
theory of everything or brian keating

1271
00:44:05,589 --> 00:44:03,359
had tom delong on his podcast and they

1272
00:44:07,349 --> 00:44:05,599
find smaller podcasts like mine and they

1273
00:44:09,829 --> 00:44:07,359
start to explore the subject a lot more

1274
00:44:11,270 --> 00:44:09,839
so for a podcast like joe rogan there's

1275
00:44:13,430 --> 00:44:11,280
going to be millions of people who of

1276
00:44:15,190 --> 00:44:13,440
course they know about ufos but there's

1277
00:44:17,670 --> 00:44:15,200
no real interest there and someone like

1278
00:44:20,309 --> 00:44:17,680
you and potentially the book could be a

1279
00:44:22,069 --> 00:44:20,319
huge spark for that mainstream push and

1280
00:44:23,750 --> 00:44:22,079
that can only help the conversation in

1281
00:44:24,790 --> 00:44:23,760
terms of the the american people for a

1282
00:44:26,790 --> 00:44:24,800
start

1283
00:44:29,430 --> 00:44:26,800
getting this conversation going through

1284
00:44:30,309 --> 00:44:29,440
local constituencies you know from their

1285
00:44:32,630 --> 00:44:30,319
um

1286
00:44:34,230 --> 00:44:32,640
their elected officials and and further

1287
00:44:36,069 --> 00:44:34,240
up the chain wouldn't it

1288
00:44:38,309 --> 00:44:36,079
yeah i don't disagree with you um but

1289
00:44:40,230 --> 00:44:38,319
like i said you know i i don't control

1290
00:44:41,030 --> 00:44:40,240
you know mr rogan's schedule i don't i

1291
00:44:45,430 --> 00:44:41,040
don't

1292
00:44:49,270 --> 00:44:47,750
you know i i

1293
00:44:51,270 --> 00:44:49,280
i think it's pretty obvious i'm pulling

1294
00:44:55,190 --> 00:44:51,280
away from social media

1295
00:44:56,870 --> 00:44:55,200
um it's become a bit of a distraction um

1296
00:44:58,870 --> 00:44:56,880
unfortunately my presence that the

1297
00:45:02,069 --> 00:44:58,880
conversation has shifted more about me

1298
00:45:03,829 --> 00:45:02,079
and less about transparency and ufos

1299
00:45:05,510 --> 00:45:03,839
you know every day people are are

1300
00:45:07,670 --> 00:45:05,520
fighting over literally the choice of

1301
00:45:10,230 --> 00:45:07,680
one word that people use and it's it's

1302
00:45:12,150 --> 00:45:10,240
silly you know and it's it's just

1303
00:45:13,510 --> 00:45:12,160
it takes away because people who really

1304
00:45:14,950 --> 00:45:13,520
want to learn about this topic for the

1305
00:45:16,870 --> 00:45:14,960
first time the first thing they do is

1306
00:45:18,870 --> 00:45:16,880
they they jump on on

1307
00:45:20,950 --> 00:45:18,880
you know the social media maybe ufo

1308
00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:20,960
twitter and and it's it's just a

1309
00:45:24,630 --> 00:45:23,280
cesspool of of of bickering and

1310
00:45:27,109 --> 00:45:24,640
infighting over

1311
00:45:30,150 --> 00:45:27,119
stupid stuff you know and

1312
00:45:31,750 --> 00:45:30,160
and unfortunately it inadvertently i may

1313
00:45:32,710 --> 00:45:31,760
be part of the cause of that because

1314
00:45:34,630 --> 00:45:32,720
people

1315
00:45:36,150 --> 00:45:34,640
focus on me rather than the message

1316
00:45:37,349 --> 00:45:36,160
they're focused on the messenger and not

1317
00:45:39,190 --> 00:45:37,359
the message

1318
00:45:41,430 --> 00:45:39,200
and um

1319
00:45:44,309 --> 00:45:41,440
you know i i it's it's problematic and

1320
00:45:46,390 --> 00:45:44,319
that's why you there is a probably a

1321
00:45:49,589 --> 00:45:46,400
very obvious absence

1322
00:45:51,190 --> 00:45:49,599
uh of my presence on on social media i'm

1323
00:45:53,030 --> 00:45:51,200
really trying to do

1324
00:45:54,790 --> 00:45:53,040
to disclosure a favor

1325
00:45:56,870 --> 00:45:54,800
because i see that people are beginning

1326
00:45:59,190 --> 00:45:56,880
to act like like children and they get

1327
00:46:01,829 --> 00:45:59,200
very very petty and they start attacking

1328
00:46:03,430 --> 00:46:01,839
each other and it's uh i i don't have

1329
00:46:06,230 --> 00:46:03,440
the time for it and the topic's too

1330
00:46:07,990 --> 00:46:06,240
important really to to to to get

1331
00:46:10,230 --> 00:46:08,000
yourself involved in that you know

1332
00:46:12,710 --> 00:46:10,240
tempest in a teapot

1333
00:46:15,270 --> 00:46:12,720
um the topic deserves

1334
00:46:17,589 --> 00:46:15,280
much more respect than that and so

1335
00:46:19,670 --> 00:46:17,599
um joe rogan if he were again going back

1336
00:46:21,910 --> 00:46:19,680
to the question would i do it

1337
00:46:23,670 --> 00:46:21,920
i don't know i i'd have to see you know

1338
00:46:24,790 --> 00:46:23,680
his content i don't i don't listen to

1339
00:46:27,349 --> 00:46:24,800
joe rogan

1340
00:46:29,670 --> 00:46:27,359
um it is a way to have the conversation

1341
00:46:30,870 --> 00:46:29,680
and and have a fair conversation if

1342
00:46:32,309 --> 00:46:30,880
people are interested in the topic then

1343
00:46:34,550 --> 00:46:32,319
yeah i'd probably do it

1344
00:46:36,150 --> 00:46:34,560
but if it's to go there and you know do

1345
00:46:37,829 --> 00:46:36,160
something like that you know like the

1346
00:46:38,950 --> 00:46:37,839
old jerry springer show and just you

1347
00:46:41,670 --> 00:46:38,960
know

1348
00:46:44,630 --> 00:46:41,680
sensationalism and salaciousness i'm not

1349
00:46:46,390 --> 00:46:44,640
interested in doing that

1350
00:46:48,150 --> 00:46:46,400
i'll just add to the the social media

1351
00:46:49,750 --> 00:46:48,160
side of things i understand that i think

1352
00:46:51,990 --> 00:46:49,760
the other day i saw someone comment lou

1353
00:46:53,670 --> 00:46:52,000
you'd shared an anecdote which no doubt

1354
00:46:55,750 --> 00:46:53,680
you've shared similar anecdotes many

1355
00:46:57,430 --> 00:46:55,760
times and within the anecdote the name

1356
00:46:59,430 --> 00:46:57,440
of a football team i think it was

1357
00:47:01,190 --> 00:46:59,440
changed and that's what someone argued

1358
00:47:02,790 --> 00:47:01,200
about and picked up on that you were

1359
00:47:04,630 --> 00:47:02,800
clearly lying because the name of the

1360
00:47:06,309 --> 00:47:04,640
team had changed and it was like that's

1361
00:47:08,630 --> 00:47:06,319
that's not the point that the sentence

1362
00:47:10,150 --> 00:47:08,640
to be focusing on but it's one of those

1363
00:47:11,829 --> 00:47:10,160
that people won't know what they've got

1364
00:47:13,910 --> 00:47:11,839
until it's gone which generally happens

1365
00:47:16,630 --> 00:47:13,920
and not only yourself but other other

1366
00:47:18,150 --> 00:47:16,640
social media yeah no it's it's it's it's

1367
00:47:19,750 --> 00:47:18,160
a silly right because you say might be

1368
00:47:22,790 --> 00:47:19,760
dolphins versus buying hurricanes you

1369
00:47:25,589 --> 00:47:22,800
know it's just it's so it's so dumb

1370
00:47:27,990 --> 00:47:25,599
and it's um it's it's a distraction from

1371
00:47:29,190 --> 00:47:28,000
from the real conversation and

1372
00:47:30,870 --> 00:47:29,200
people don't people don't understand

1373
00:47:32,150 --> 00:47:30,880
they just don't get it you know they

1374
00:47:33,430 --> 00:47:32,160
also will

1375
00:47:35,829 --> 00:47:33,440
point out well

1376
00:47:37,510 --> 00:47:35,839
you know lou said this but foyer didn't

1377
00:47:39,750 --> 00:47:37,520
you know prove that there's no there's

1378
00:47:41,349 --> 00:47:39,760
no foia documentation

1379
00:47:43,030 --> 00:47:41,359
foyer isn't king

1380
00:47:44,549 --> 00:47:43,040
you might have a king of foia but the

1381
00:47:46,069 --> 00:47:44,559
foia isn't king

1382
00:47:48,069 --> 00:47:46,079
uh there's a lot that happens that's

1383
00:47:50,390 --> 00:47:48,079
that's done verbally this entire podcast

1384
00:47:52,710 --> 00:47:50,400
you know you can't point it

1385
00:47:54,950 --> 00:47:52,720
we're having a conversation where a lot

1386
00:47:56,309 --> 00:47:54,960
of information is exchanged and that's

1387
00:47:57,670 --> 00:47:56,319
true inside the government and just

1388
00:48:01,349 --> 00:47:57,680
people

1389
00:48:02,710 --> 00:48:01,359
and it's again it's i think it's a

1390
00:48:05,190 --> 00:48:02,720
distraction

1391
00:48:07,750 --> 00:48:05,200
we're not doing the cause any favors and

1392
00:48:11,829 --> 00:48:07,760
people who come in fresh they see this

1393
00:48:12,710 --> 00:48:11,839
and it's it's just a mosh pit of of egos

1394
00:48:18,069 --> 00:48:12,720
and

1395
00:48:19,829 --> 00:48:18,079
petty little money-making enterprises

1396
00:48:21,910 --> 00:48:19,839
and want to control the narrative i mean

1397
00:48:23,829 --> 00:48:21,920
it's just it's just silly and so uh

1398
00:48:25,510 --> 00:48:23,839
let's let's elevate this conversation to

1399
00:48:27,670 --> 00:48:25,520
where it belongs where it deserves put

1400
00:48:29,829 --> 00:48:27,680
it on the pedestal where and just take

1401
00:48:32,230 --> 00:48:29,839
it out of the the muddy ditch

1402
00:48:34,790 --> 00:48:32,240
that it keeps finding itself in

1403
00:48:36,230 --> 00:48:34,800
and um so that's that's

1404
00:48:37,910 --> 00:48:36,240
yeah that's that's my perspective

1405
00:48:39,430 --> 00:48:37,920
anyways

1406
00:48:41,190 --> 00:48:39,440
no that's fair and amongst those

1407
00:48:42,630 --> 00:48:41,200
dissenting voices and the drama and the

1408
00:48:44,549 --> 00:48:42,640
infighting there's a lot of great people

1409
00:48:46,870 --> 00:48:44,559
and it's nice to speak to those and i

1410
00:48:49,349 --> 00:48:46,880
can see your point i think within the to

1411
00:48:51,750 --> 00:48:49,359
move on the conversation with us here

1412
00:48:54,309 --> 00:48:51,760
some of the the down period or quiet

1413
00:48:56,950 --> 00:48:54,319
period causes folk to need to make that

1414
00:48:59,270 --> 00:48:56,960
drama and in the build up to the uap

1415
00:49:01,109 --> 00:48:59,280
task force report we had an excitement

1416
00:49:03,030 --> 00:49:01,119
and a building of momentum uh the

1417
00:49:05,030 --> 00:49:03,040
mainstream media coverage was picking up

1418
00:49:07,270 --> 00:49:05,040
that was led from the front by people

1419
00:49:09,589 --> 00:49:07,280
like yourself sean cahill chris mellon

1420
00:49:12,790 --> 00:49:09,599
and others appearing on shows around the

1421
00:49:15,430 --> 00:49:12,800
world that certainly peaked as 2021 drew

1422
00:49:17,190 --> 00:49:15,440
to a close as the report came and you

1423
00:49:19,589 --> 00:49:17,200
know things were implemented in the

1424
00:49:22,309 --> 00:49:19,599
background and then went quiet

1425
00:49:23,990 --> 00:49:22,319
when do you see that potential next wave

1426
00:49:26,950 --> 00:49:24,000
beginning to happen again or is it

1427
00:49:29,670 --> 00:49:26,960
underway it's underway um look you know

1428
00:49:32,230 --> 00:49:29,680
the problem is that we as a society

1429
00:49:35,030 --> 00:49:32,240
have become so hooked on instant

1430
00:49:37,670 --> 00:49:35,040
gratification and that that that sean

1431
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:37,680
likes to say that dopamine hit right

1432
00:49:42,549 --> 00:49:40,240
that we are now at the point where we

1433
00:49:43,990 --> 00:49:42,559
can do within a punch of a button i can

1434
00:49:45,510 --> 00:49:44,000
shop online i can get something

1435
00:49:46,950 --> 00:49:45,520
delivered to my house i can get food

1436
00:49:48,870 --> 00:49:46,960
delivered to my house i can you know

1437
00:49:50,710 --> 00:49:48,880
it's as some of the advertisements for

1438
00:49:52,710 --> 00:49:50,720
fast food companies have it your way and

1439
00:49:54,710 --> 00:49:52,720
have it now right

1440
00:49:56,790 --> 00:49:54,720
we we've we've become so

1441
00:49:57,589 --> 00:49:56,800
accustomed to that that

1442
00:49:59,510 --> 00:49:57,599
that

1443
00:50:00,870 --> 00:49:59,520
and information is really at the tip of

1444
00:50:03,349 --> 00:50:00,880
our hands i need anything you want to do

1445
00:50:05,589 --> 00:50:03,359
is jump online and like you know get

1446
00:50:07,750 --> 00:50:05,599
answers that i need i can pull a youtube

1447
00:50:09,910 --> 00:50:07,760
video on how to do something um

1448
00:50:12,150 --> 00:50:09,920
instantly and the problem is this topic

1449
00:50:14,470 --> 00:50:12,160
is not an there's no instant solution

1450
00:50:17,349 --> 00:50:14,480
there's no instant answer and so

1451
00:50:19,030 --> 00:50:17,359
so people get get impatient with that

1452
00:50:20,790 --> 00:50:19,040
and with that impatience they get

1453
00:50:21,990 --> 00:50:20,800
frustrated with that frustration if you

1454
00:50:23,750 --> 00:50:22,000
get angry

1455
00:50:25,190 --> 00:50:23,760
and you know this is why i've told

1456
00:50:27,190 --> 00:50:25,200
people before and i know they don't like

1457
00:50:28,549 --> 00:50:27,200
the advice look if if

1458
00:50:29,829 --> 00:50:28,559
if you find yourself frustrated and

1459
00:50:32,150 --> 00:50:29,839
angry

1460
00:50:33,750 --> 00:50:32,160
maybe tune out for five years and check

1461
00:50:35,510 --> 00:50:33,760
back in five years and see where we are

1462
00:50:37,670 --> 00:50:35,520
in the conversation because

1463
00:50:39,030 --> 00:50:37,680
this isn't instant gratification this

1464
00:50:40,309 --> 00:50:39,040
isn't i'm not gonna

1465
00:50:42,230 --> 00:50:40,319
and i'm not gonna tell you what to think

1466
00:50:43,829 --> 00:50:42,240
about it right you turn to the most

1467
00:50:44,870 --> 00:50:43,839
media outlets today not only are they

1468
00:50:46,390 --> 00:50:44,880
gonna tell you the news but they're

1469
00:50:47,589 --> 00:50:46,400
gonna tell you what you should think

1470
00:50:50,150 --> 00:50:47,599
about it because it's mostly a big

1471
00:50:52,150 --> 00:50:50,160
editorial really um most media outlets

1472
00:50:53,109 --> 00:50:52,160
are that way not all but but a lot of

1473
00:50:55,109 --> 00:50:53,119
them are

1474
00:50:57,510 --> 00:50:55,119
and so that's problematic because we

1475
00:50:58,870 --> 00:50:57,520
become so lazy as a society not only do

1476
00:51:00,630 --> 00:50:58,880
we want to know what's going on but we

1477
00:51:02,150 --> 00:51:00,640
also want to be told what to think about

1478
00:51:04,710 --> 00:51:02,160
because we're too lazy to even think for

1479
00:51:06,790 --> 00:51:04,720
ourselves half the time and and that's a

1480
00:51:09,589 --> 00:51:06,800
shame and this topic is so important and

1481
00:51:12,549 --> 00:51:09,599
it's so so so

1482
00:51:13,990 --> 00:51:12,559
revolutionary for our species that that

1483
00:51:15,430 --> 00:51:14,000
it deserves

1484
00:51:18,309 --> 00:51:15,440
time and patience

1485
00:51:21,109 --> 00:51:18,319
it deserves respect it deserves

1486
00:51:22,630 --> 00:51:21,119
to have you know really really smart

1487
00:51:25,670 --> 00:51:22,640
people from around the world and

1488
00:51:28,150 --> 00:51:25,680
academia and science and technology to

1489
00:51:29,990 --> 00:51:28,160
to to look at this problem and it's not

1490
00:51:30,950 --> 00:51:30,000
going to be solved overnight it's just

1491
00:51:32,470 --> 00:51:30,960
not

1492
00:51:33,589 --> 00:51:32,480
and i know that's hard for a lot of

1493
00:51:36,150 --> 00:51:33,599
people because they're like well we've

1494
00:51:38,390 --> 00:51:36,160
already known for 70 years well okay

1495
00:51:40,470 --> 00:51:38,400
we've known some but we don't have the

1496
00:51:42,710 --> 00:51:40,480
answers yet and and

1497
00:51:44,309 --> 00:51:42,720
in that void don't be tempted to start

1498
00:51:46,549 --> 00:51:44,319
speculating and creating your own

1499
00:51:48,230 --> 00:51:46,559
narrative that well you know this must

1500
00:51:50,150 --> 00:51:48,240
be the case and therefore we've had you

1501
00:51:52,230 --> 00:51:50,160
know a treaty alliance with the

1502
00:51:54,390 --> 00:51:52,240
pleiadians and we're fighting the

1503
00:51:56,390 --> 00:51:54,400
reptilians and all that nonsense

1504
00:51:58,390 --> 00:51:56,400
it's not helpful to the pawns

1505
00:52:00,630 --> 00:51:58,400
people people have a tendency to fill

1506
00:52:03,430 --> 00:52:00,640
those gaps information gaps

1507
00:52:05,910 --> 00:52:03,440
with speculation and and although it's

1508
00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:05,920
okay to speculate we have to

1509
00:52:10,710 --> 00:52:08,000
we have to be cognizant of the fact that

1510
00:52:13,109 --> 00:52:10,720
speculation is just speculation it's not

1511
00:52:14,710 --> 00:52:13,119
fact and we we confuse our beliefs a lot

1512
00:52:16,710 --> 00:52:14,720
of times with what we think and with

1513
00:52:19,109 --> 00:52:16,720
what we know and and they're not

1514
00:52:23,430 --> 00:52:19,119
necessarily you know they're not

1515
00:52:26,790 --> 00:52:25,349
moving on to the future i've got a

1516
00:52:28,630 --> 00:52:26,800
couple of questions here you've just

1517
00:52:31,109 --> 00:52:28,640
mentioned that the come back in five

1518
00:52:32,950 --> 00:52:31,119
years comment you've made that before

1519
00:52:35,349 --> 00:52:32,960
what could the landscape of this

1520
00:52:36,950 --> 00:52:35,359
conversation look like realistically

1521
00:52:38,790 --> 00:52:36,960
with the progress being made now and

1522
00:52:41,190 --> 00:52:38,800
looking at potential growth or

1523
00:52:42,630 --> 00:52:41,200
accelerated progress what could it look

1524
00:52:44,950 --> 00:52:42,640
like

1525
00:52:46,950 --> 00:52:44,960
wow well

1526
00:52:48,549 --> 00:52:46,960
let me answer that by saying i am

1527
00:52:50,790 --> 00:52:48,559
extremely hopeful for this next

1528
00:52:52,710 --> 00:52:50,800
generation um

1529
00:52:56,230 --> 00:52:52,720
it is this next generation that is going

1530
00:52:57,910 --> 00:52:56,240
to to to inherit this this topic

1531
00:53:01,030 --> 00:52:57,920
and hopefully not make the same mistakes

1532
00:53:02,870 --> 00:53:01,040
my generation made regarding this topic

1533
00:53:05,109 --> 00:53:02,880
i think most of the answers are are

1534
00:53:06,390 --> 00:53:05,119
going to be within the next 20 years

1535
00:53:07,910 --> 00:53:06,400
that a lot of the

1536
00:53:09,670 --> 00:53:07,920
answers we're looking for we may have

1537
00:53:11,190 --> 00:53:09,680
answered the next 20 years and i think

1538
00:53:12,710 --> 00:53:11,200
it's going to be up to this next

1539
00:53:15,270 --> 00:53:12,720
generation

1540
00:53:17,430 --> 00:53:15,280
to solve some of these these these big

1541
00:53:20,230 --> 00:53:17,440
questions um

1542
00:53:21,670 --> 00:53:20,240
i i you know i i think we can

1543
00:53:23,510 --> 00:53:21,680
hopefully

1544
00:53:25,190 --> 00:53:23,520
first of all know what our government

1545
00:53:27,349 --> 00:53:25,200
has known for the last seven years about

1546
00:53:30,150 --> 00:53:27,359
this topic first and foremost before we

1547
00:53:32,470 --> 00:53:30,160
can go move forward we first need to

1548
00:53:34,870 --> 00:53:32,480
to to get a handle on what we already

1549
00:53:36,309 --> 00:53:34,880
know and and that's going to be a very

1550
00:53:37,829 --> 00:53:36,319
difficult task

1551
00:53:39,270 --> 00:53:37,839
because there's a lot of interest in

1552
00:53:40,829 --> 00:53:39,280
equities at stake

1553
00:53:43,270 --> 00:53:40,839
there's there's a lot

1554
00:53:45,430 --> 00:53:43,280
of baggage

1555
00:53:47,430 --> 00:53:45,440
and that baggage needs to be sorted out

1556
00:53:49,750 --> 00:53:47,440
and addressed

1557
00:53:52,069 --> 00:53:49,760
so my hope is that the next 20 years we

1558
00:53:54,470 --> 00:53:52,079
will have i guess in the future right

1559
00:53:56,309 --> 00:53:54,480
that we we know more about the past

1560
00:53:58,950 --> 00:53:56,319
we can have a definitive understanding

1561
00:54:01,270 --> 00:53:58,960
of who was involved in what projects

1562
00:54:03,910 --> 00:54:01,280
and what what insight was gained as a

1563
00:54:05,510 --> 00:54:03,920
result of those efforts

1564
00:54:07,030 --> 00:54:05,520
if we can achieve that in the next 20

1565
00:54:08,870 --> 00:54:07,040
years then i think the following 20

1566
00:54:11,510 --> 00:54:08,880
years after that we can start

1567
00:54:13,510 --> 00:54:11,520
maybe getting answers to some of the big

1568
00:54:15,349 --> 00:54:13,520
questions right that everybody wants to

1569
00:54:17,270 --> 00:54:15,359
know where are they from what are the

1570
00:54:21,270 --> 00:54:17,280
intent what's the intent you know what

1571
00:54:25,109 --> 00:54:22,950
that's that's just me personally

1572
00:54:26,069 --> 00:54:25,119
speaking i could be wrong

1573
00:54:27,990 --> 00:54:26,079
but

1574
00:54:30,390 --> 00:54:28,000
that's that's that's my that's my

1575
00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:30,400
perspective

1576
00:54:33,589 --> 00:54:31,760
i'm going to ask you a question just

1577
00:54:35,109 --> 00:54:33,599
because you mentioned there

1578
00:54:37,670 --> 00:54:35,119
what who could they be where could they

1579
00:54:39,190 --> 00:54:37,680
be from etc and dan might laugh at this

1580
00:54:40,950 --> 00:54:39,200
because i called him when i thought

1581
00:54:44,309 --> 00:54:40,960
about this on the bus home from work the

1582
00:54:46,549 --> 00:54:44,319
other day and i very badly um

1583
00:54:49,430 --> 00:54:46,559
elaborated to him what i wanted to ask

1584
00:54:51,349 --> 00:54:49,440
if we as a species lou discovered the

1585
00:54:53,750 --> 00:54:51,359
technology to travel in different

1586
00:54:56,230 --> 00:54:53,760
dimensions space or time we land upon a

1587
00:54:58,069 --> 00:54:56,240
craft and we can zip in to say a

1588
00:55:00,150 --> 00:54:58,079
different dimension like you've talked

1589
00:55:02,549 --> 00:55:00,160
about before there's potential a shadow

1590
00:55:03,990 --> 00:55:02,559
biome or maybe they're here but not here

1591
00:55:06,069 --> 00:55:04,000
directly

1592
00:55:08,789 --> 00:55:06,079
how would we as a species do you think

1593
00:55:10,870 --> 00:55:08,799
use that technology would we behave in a

1594
00:55:13,030 --> 00:55:10,880
similar way to how these others may be

1595
00:55:14,390 --> 00:55:13,040
behaving

1596
00:55:17,109 --> 00:55:14,400
you know

1597
00:55:20,150 --> 00:55:17,119
mother nature she's she's really clever

1598
00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:20,160
she's had a long time to figure out uh

1599
00:55:23,190 --> 00:55:21,520
biology

1600
00:55:24,789 --> 00:55:23,200
and there may be a reason why we don't

1601
00:55:26,789 --> 00:55:24,799
have the answers yet that we're seeking

1602
00:55:29,109 --> 00:55:26,799
maybe we're just simply as a species not

1603
00:55:30,870 --> 00:55:29,119
ready for it right

1604
00:55:31,990 --> 00:55:30,880
perhaps we're not ready for nuclear

1605
00:55:34,549 --> 00:55:32,000
technology

1606
00:55:37,430 --> 00:55:34,559
look look look of the angst that is

1607
00:55:39,109 --> 00:55:37,440
causing right now in the ukraine and now

1608
00:55:40,069 --> 00:55:39,119
you have you know

1609
00:55:41,910 --> 00:55:40,079
uh

1610
00:55:43,670 --> 00:55:41,920
two countries that are fighting each

1611
00:55:45,670 --> 00:55:43,680
other potentially putting the entire

1612
00:55:47,670 --> 00:55:45,680
world at the brink of war right and

1613
00:55:48,789 --> 00:55:47,680
annihilating all living species on this

1614
00:55:49,589 --> 00:55:48,799
planet

1615
00:55:52,069 --> 00:55:49,599
um

1616
00:55:55,030 --> 00:55:52,079
are we really ready for that technology

1617
00:55:56,630 --> 00:55:55,040
uh as a species um

1618
00:55:58,710 --> 00:55:56,640
i i don't know

1619
00:55:59,829 --> 00:55:58,720
you know are we giving a loaded handgun

1620
00:56:01,270 --> 00:55:59,839
to a child

1621
00:56:03,109 --> 00:56:01,280
if we were to have this type of

1622
00:56:05,349 --> 00:56:03,119
technology

1623
00:56:07,510 --> 00:56:05,359
you know i think some some people

1624
00:56:09,430 --> 00:56:07,520
are probably

1625
00:56:10,789 --> 00:56:09,440
ready for it and could be trusted with

1626
00:56:11,990 --> 00:56:10,799
it but there's a whole lot of people

1627
00:56:13,829 --> 00:56:12,000
that

1628
00:56:15,670 --> 00:56:13,839
i don't think can be you know we have

1629
00:56:17,589 --> 00:56:15,680
rogue nations out there

1630
00:56:19,270 --> 00:56:17,599
all the time and look i'm gonna i'm a

1631
00:56:20,870 --> 00:56:19,280
patriot to my country but i'm gonna tell

1632
00:56:22,470 --> 00:56:20,880
you you know there's only been one

1633
00:56:25,270 --> 00:56:22,480
country so far in the last century

1634
00:56:27,430 --> 00:56:25,280
that's ever used

1635
00:56:29,030 --> 00:56:27,440
an atomic technology against you know

1636
00:56:30,789 --> 00:56:29,040
other human beings that was my country

1637
00:56:32,789 --> 00:56:30,799
in world war ii now arguably it may have

1638
00:56:34,470 --> 00:56:32,799
saved many more lives

1639
00:56:36,630 --> 00:56:34,480
uh but but

1640
00:56:38,710 --> 00:56:36,640
we you know the moment we we discovered

1641
00:56:40,150 --> 00:56:38,720
that technology we use it against our

1642
00:56:41,670 --> 00:56:40,160
fellow man

1643
00:56:43,109 --> 00:56:41,680
and that's that's

1644
00:56:44,789 --> 00:56:43,119
that's problematic because that's human

1645
00:56:46,309 --> 00:56:44,799
nature that's not just an american thing

1646
00:56:48,950 --> 00:56:46,319
it's not just a russian or a chinese

1647
00:56:49,829 --> 00:56:48,960
thing that's that's human nature

1648
00:56:52,230 --> 00:56:49,839
you know

1649
00:56:54,630 --> 00:56:52,240
you give one monkey uh

1650
00:56:56,870 --> 00:56:54,640
a stone and you give another monkey a

1651
00:56:58,230 --> 00:56:56,880
club well guess what they're gonna use

1652
00:57:00,549 --> 00:56:58,240
it against each other because that's

1653
00:57:03,349 --> 00:57:00,559
that's what we do you know species tend

1654
00:57:05,589 --> 00:57:03,359
to be violent uh unfortunately because

1655
00:57:07,829 --> 00:57:05,599
it's part of our evolution for survival

1656
00:57:10,710 --> 00:57:07,839
and the competition for resources it's

1657
00:57:11,910 --> 00:57:10,720
it's innate it's it's part of our our

1658
00:57:13,510 --> 00:57:11,920
dna

1659
00:57:15,829 --> 00:57:13,520
plants even do it they compete for

1660
00:57:18,549 --> 00:57:15,839
resources humans do it every animal on

1661
00:57:21,349 --> 00:57:18,559
this planet it's almost uh an unwritten

1662
00:57:23,990 --> 00:57:21,359
rule of survival right

1663
00:57:27,349 --> 00:57:24,000
so are we prepared for some sort of

1664
00:57:31,430 --> 00:57:27,359
technology that now we can export

1665
00:57:33,750 --> 00:57:31,440
uh our our tendencies um

1666
00:57:35,589 --> 00:57:33,760
perhaps across the cosmos

1667
00:57:38,069 --> 00:57:35,599
you know would it would that even be

1668
00:57:40,549 --> 00:57:38,079
wise knowing how we how we behave with

1669
00:57:42,069 --> 00:57:40,559
each other are we really prepared to be

1670
00:57:44,549 --> 00:57:42,079
part of any if there is some sort of

1671
00:57:47,670 --> 00:57:44,559
cosmic community so to speak are we

1672
00:57:49,750 --> 00:57:47,680
really even prepared to to to interact

1673
00:57:50,789 --> 00:57:49,760
with that um

1674
00:57:53,910 --> 00:57:50,799
you know

1675
00:57:56,150 --> 00:57:53,920
i i'm not so sure that we are but i do

1676
00:57:58,069 --> 00:57:56,160
also think that the truth is important i

1677
00:58:00,549 --> 00:57:58,079
think we must tell the truth i think our

1678
00:58:02,789 --> 00:58:00,559
species is prepared for the reality that

1679
00:58:04,549 --> 00:58:02,799
we're not alone now i'm not saying we're

1680
00:58:06,470 --> 00:58:04,559
necessarily prepared to

1681
00:58:07,990 --> 00:58:06,480
to go out there and engage

1682
00:58:11,349 --> 00:58:08,000
but but the mere fact that we're not

1683
00:58:13,670 --> 00:58:11,359
alone is i think it's it's that's not a

1684
00:58:16,230 --> 00:58:13,680
a fact that should be classified or kept

1685
00:58:17,109 --> 00:58:16,240
secret from from from from citizens of

1686
00:58:19,270 --> 00:58:17,119
the world

1687
00:58:21,589 --> 00:58:19,280
i also think it might help us

1688
00:58:23,190 --> 00:58:21,599
maybe just maybe treat each other a

1689
00:58:25,670 --> 00:58:23,200
little better if we know that there's

1690
00:58:28,150 --> 00:58:25,680
something bigger out there something

1691
00:58:29,270 --> 00:58:28,160
something that is is now touchable if

1692
00:58:31,829 --> 00:58:29,280
you will

1693
00:58:33,510 --> 00:58:31,839
um you know can we learn from that can

1694
00:58:35,349 --> 00:58:33,520
can we learn the fact that hey you know

1695
00:58:36,950 --> 00:58:35,359
we don't have to destroy ourselves to

1696
00:58:38,630 --> 00:58:36,960
evolve we don't have to

1697
00:58:40,470 --> 00:58:38,640
beat each other up with a club or a

1698
00:58:42,390 --> 00:58:40,480
stone you know we can work together and

1699
00:58:43,030 --> 00:58:42,400
maybe use a club in the stone as a tool

1700
00:58:45,430 --> 00:58:43,040
and

1701
00:58:50,870 --> 00:58:45,440
to the benefit of the of you know of of

1702
00:58:55,270 --> 00:58:52,390
let me ask just to follow that on

1703
00:58:56,549 --> 00:58:55,280
slightly and hopefully i want this this

1704
00:58:58,870 --> 00:58:56,559
appropriately

1705
00:59:00,549 --> 00:58:58,880
say a group of responsible individuals

1706
00:59:02,309 --> 00:59:00,559
i'm going to say yourself and

1707
00:59:04,549 --> 00:59:02,319
christopher mellon are giving this

1708
00:59:05,589 --> 00:59:04,559
technology okay

1709
00:59:07,750 --> 00:59:05,599
would you

1710
00:59:10,069 --> 00:59:07,760
behave the same way

1711
00:59:11,910 --> 00:59:10,079
observing another intelligent species on

1712
00:59:13,910 --> 00:59:11,920
their planet would you stay at a great

1713
00:59:16,150 --> 00:59:13,920
height would you observe their navy from

1714
00:59:17,829 --> 00:59:16,160
a distance you know

1715
00:59:19,270 --> 00:59:17,839
do you appreciate how these objects

1716
00:59:21,109 --> 00:59:19,280
appear to behave and do you think we

1717
00:59:23,589 --> 00:59:21,119
would do exactly the same

1718
00:59:25,990 --> 00:59:23,599
well we we do now don't we when we when

1719
00:59:28,150 --> 00:59:26,000
we fly over the the serengeti in africa

1720
00:59:30,630 --> 00:59:28,160
with the helicopter looking at the the

1721
00:59:33,109 --> 00:59:30,640
migratory patterns of wildebeest right

1722
00:59:34,630 --> 00:59:33,119
we stay a safe distance we we fly over

1723
00:59:36,710 --> 00:59:34,640
the herd probably scare the hell out of

1724
00:59:39,109 --> 00:59:36,720
them when we're flying sometimes we may

1725
00:59:41,109 --> 00:59:39,119
decide to dart one and pull some blood

1726
00:59:44,069 --> 00:59:41,119
samples to to see you know the health of

1727
00:59:47,829 --> 00:59:44,079
the herd and whatnot the reproductive

1728
00:59:49,750 --> 00:59:47,839
uh health and and then uh you know we we

1729
00:59:51,589 --> 00:59:49,760
fly away and of course the wildebeest

1730
00:59:53,030 --> 00:59:51,599
wakes up you know a couple hours later

1731
00:59:55,109 --> 00:59:53,040
with you know a sore button like what

1732
00:59:56,150 --> 00:59:55,119
the hell was that

1733
00:59:58,789 --> 00:59:56,160
um

1734
01:00:01,589 --> 00:59:58,799
we we do that now we do it in the deep

1735
01:00:03,750 --> 01:00:01,599
oceans uh we that's that's kind of the

1736
01:00:04,789 --> 01:00:03,760
what what science does isn't it we

1737
01:00:07,349 --> 01:00:04,799
observe

1738
01:00:09,270 --> 01:00:07,359
science is the art of observation

1739
01:00:11,190 --> 01:00:09,280
uh and and understanding and in order to

1740
01:00:13,270 --> 01:00:11,200
understand you have to observe and i

1741
01:00:15,030 --> 01:00:13,280
think that's precisely probably what

1742
01:00:16,710 --> 01:00:15,040
what we would do anyways whether whether

1743
01:00:19,190 --> 01:00:16,720
it's me or chris or not

1744
01:00:21,030 --> 01:00:19,200
i think we would do that as a species uh

1745
01:00:22,710 --> 01:00:21,040
we would we would

1746
01:00:25,349 --> 01:00:22,720
continue doing what we do now with our

1747
01:00:28,390 --> 01:00:25,359
own with even our own species right

1748
01:00:32,710 --> 01:00:31,030
you mentioned that 20 years time future

1749
01:00:34,309 --> 01:00:32,720
generations may benefit from the

1750
01:00:36,309 --> 01:00:34,319
questions and the progress that's hap

1751
01:00:37,829 --> 01:00:36,319
that are happening now one of the tools

1752
01:00:39,670 --> 01:00:37,839
that we'll have in just a few months is

1753
01:00:42,069 --> 01:00:39,680
the james webb telescope which will be

1754
01:00:44,230 --> 01:00:42,079
up and running at full functionality how

1755
01:00:46,150 --> 01:00:44,240
important a role in our understanding of

1756
01:00:48,710 --> 01:00:46,160
who we are and are we alone do you think

1757
01:00:50,470 --> 01:00:48,720
this will or could play

1758
01:00:52,309 --> 01:00:50,480
yeah i mean it's just another tool in

1759
01:00:53,910 --> 01:00:52,319
the tool bag isn't it right i mean you

1760
01:00:55,670 --> 01:00:53,920
don't build a house with just a hammer

1761
01:00:57,910 --> 01:00:55,680
or just a screwdriver you have to have a

1762
01:00:59,750 --> 01:00:57,920
tool bag to to build a house

1763
01:01:01,910 --> 01:00:59,760
and and that's precisely what the james

1764
01:01:03,349 --> 01:01:01,920
webb telescope is in the galileo project

1765
01:01:05,270 --> 01:01:03,359
with what they're doing

1766
01:01:07,030 --> 01:01:05,280
and other other efforts um you know

1767
01:01:10,230 --> 01:01:07,040
these are just another tool that you

1768
01:01:12,230 --> 01:01:10,240
need ultimately to to build the house um

1769
01:01:13,030 --> 01:01:12,240
some tools are used more than others

1770
01:01:15,270 --> 01:01:13,040
um

1771
01:01:17,109 --> 01:01:15,280
but at the end of the day you know it

1772
01:01:18,710 --> 01:01:17,119
you really want a complete tool bag if

1773
01:01:20,230 --> 01:01:18,720
you want to do a good job and build it

1774
01:01:21,270 --> 01:01:20,240
build a strong house

1775
01:01:22,950 --> 01:01:21,280
um

1776
01:01:26,309 --> 01:01:22,960
you know the problem with with

1777
01:01:28,309 --> 01:01:26,319
telescopes you know deep deep field

1778
01:01:31,430 --> 01:01:28,319
telescopes is that it's a lot like

1779
01:01:33,829 --> 01:01:31,440
looking at the sky through a straw

1780
01:01:35,750 --> 01:01:33,839
you know you can see very very far

1781
01:01:37,030 --> 01:01:35,760
but it's only a very very small portion

1782
01:01:39,109 --> 01:01:37,040
of the sky

1783
01:01:40,630 --> 01:01:39,119
and you know you also have focal issues

1784
01:01:43,030 --> 01:01:40,640
you know something

1785
01:01:45,190 --> 01:01:43,040
i i people know that i i'm

1786
01:01:46,230 --> 01:01:45,200
you know i have a i'm a bit of a gun guy

1787
01:01:48,069 --> 01:01:46,240
right i

1788
01:01:50,230 --> 01:01:48,079
have firearms and when you're looking

1789
01:01:52,470 --> 01:01:50,240
through a scope one thing is interesting

1790
01:01:54,470 --> 01:01:52,480
because when you're looking at an object

1791
01:01:55,990 --> 01:01:54,480
way way way far away

1792
01:01:58,069 --> 01:01:56,000
you can have something pass right by in

1793
01:01:59,109 --> 01:01:58,079
front of you but because the optics are

1794
01:02:01,910 --> 01:01:59,119
the way they are you're not going to

1795
01:02:03,670 --> 01:02:01,920
pick it up because the the focus is on a

1796
01:02:04,630 --> 01:02:03,680
very distant object and that's what's in

1797
01:02:06,549 --> 01:02:04,640
focus

1798
01:02:07,990 --> 01:02:06,559
anything in front of that field

1799
01:02:09,510 --> 01:02:08,000
becomes increasingly more and more

1800
01:02:10,870 --> 01:02:09,520
blurry until eventually something can

1801
01:02:11,990 --> 01:02:10,880
pass right in front of it and you won't

1802
01:02:15,190 --> 01:02:12,000
even see it

1803
01:02:17,029 --> 01:02:15,200
because the focus is so far downrange

1804
01:02:19,589 --> 01:02:17,039
that's the problem with with with a lot

1805
01:02:22,710 --> 01:02:19,599
of telescopes in general you know unless

1806
01:02:24,309 --> 01:02:22,720
you're focusing on something um

1807
01:02:25,589 --> 01:02:24,319
you're there's a really good possibility

1808
01:02:26,630 --> 01:02:25,599
you're not you're not going to see it

1809
01:02:28,069 --> 01:02:26,640
purple you have to be looking at the

1810
01:02:30,230 --> 01:02:28,079
right part of the sky and then you have

1811
01:02:32,470 --> 01:02:30,240
to be looking at the right depth

1812
01:02:34,950 --> 01:02:32,480
right and sky is as we know is infinite

1813
01:02:36,309 --> 01:02:34,960
right so how do you know where to

1814
01:02:37,430 --> 01:02:36,319
where to focus if you want to see

1815
01:02:39,270 --> 01:02:37,440
something

1816
01:02:41,029 --> 01:02:39,280
so those are some of the challenges with

1817
01:02:42,789 --> 01:02:41,039
with you know

1818
01:02:43,750 --> 01:02:42,799
modern technology it's really really

1819
01:02:45,190 --> 01:02:43,760
good

1820
01:02:46,470 --> 01:02:45,200
if you have a static object you're

1821
01:02:47,589 --> 01:02:46,480
looking at but if you have an object

1822
01:02:49,190 --> 01:02:47,599
that's moving it becomes more

1823
01:02:53,910 --> 01:02:49,200
complicated if you don't know where it's

1824
01:02:58,230 --> 01:02:55,910
you mentioned galileo project of which

1825
01:03:00,549 --> 01:02:58,240
you you are on board along with many

1826
01:03:02,789 --> 01:03:00,559
many other scientists academics and

1827
01:03:04,950 --> 01:03:02,799
people from a whole range of backgrounds

1828
01:03:06,150 --> 01:03:04,960
in what direction is the project going

1829
01:03:08,230 --> 01:03:06,160
and is it one that you've got a

1830
01:03:10,470 --> 01:03:08,240
long-term future with

1831
01:03:13,029 --> 01:03:10,480
you know i i i have to give credit where

1832
01:03:15,270 --> 01:03:13,039
credit is due um

1833
01:03:18,390 --> 01:03:15,280
you have someone like abby loeb who has

1834
01:03:21,349 --> 01:03:18,400
decided to purposely buck the system

1835
01:03:22,470 --> 01:03:21,359
uh that's that's a big deal um you know

1836
01:03:24,309 --> 01:03:22,480
what i'm going to share something with

1837
01:03:26,309 --> 01:03:24,319
you guys um

1838
01:03:28,069 --> 01:03:26,319
and uh

1839
01:03:30,789 --> 01:03:28,079
i may have shared this with a few folks

1840
01:03:32,789 --> 01:03:30,799
already i'm going to share a a

1841
01:03:35,430 --> 01:03:32,799
something that i picked up and you guys

1842
01:03:37,990 --> 01:03:35,440
can tell me what you think

1843
01:03:41,270 --> 01:03:38,000
give me one moment here

1844
01:03:44,150 --> 01:03:41,280
no problem so i'm going to pull this up

1845
01:03:47,190 --> 01:03:44,160
okay so i'm going to show this to to to

1846
01:03:50,789 --> 01:03:47,200
your folks uh it is a peanuts cartoon

1847
01:03:53,190 --> 01:03:50,799
okay and let me read if i can

1848
01:03:56,309 --> 01:03:53,200
real quick

1849
01:04:00,470 --> 01:03:56,319
quote unquote trust the science

1850
01:04:02,789 --> 01:04:00,480
is the most anti-science statement ever

1851
01:04:04,549 --> 01:04:02,799
questioning science is how you do

1852
01:04:05,829 --> 01:04:04,559
science

1853
01:04:08,789 --> 01:04:05,839
and

1854
01:04:11,029 --> 01:04:08,799
i agree with that um you know we have to

1855
01:04:12,630 --> 01:04:11,039
challenge the status quo that's the only

1856
01:04:14,950 --> 01:04:12,640
reason why

1857
01:04:16,870 --> 01:04:14,960
uh we now realize the earth is not the

1858
01:04:19,750 --> 01:04:16,880
center of the solar system you know

1859
01:04:21,670 --> 01:04:19,760
aptly named gala from galileo because

1860
01:04:22,710 --> 01:04:21,680
galileo decided to buck the system and

1861
01:04:24,230 --> 01:04:22,720
say look

1862
01:04:27,190 --> 01:04:24,240
your current understanding of the

1863
01:04:29,109 --> 01:04:27,200
universe is flawed right and of course

1864
01:04:31,430 --> 01:04:29,119
everybody he almost paid with it with

1865
01:04:32,870 --> 01:04:31,440
his life you know saying that

1866
01:04:34,950 --> 01:04:32,880
turned out he was right

1867
01:04:36,789 --> 01:04:34,960
let's not forget that every principle in

1868
01:04:37,750 --> 01:04:36,799
science that we now take for granted as

1869
01:04:41,190 --> 01:04:37,760
a law

1870
01:04:43,109 --> 01:04:41,200
started off as someone's wacky zany idea

1871
01:04:44,870 --> 01:04:43,119
you know a proposal

1872
01:04:47,270 --> 01:04:44,880
um

1873
01:04:51,109 --> 01:04:47,280
and i think galileo the project that

1874
01:04:53,270 --> 01:04:51,119
abby love is as pioneered is is is is

1875
01:04:55,430 --> 01:04:53,280
part of that spirit you know let's not

1876
01:04:57,670 --> 01:04:55,440
take for granted the things that we

1877
01:04:59,829 --> 01:04:57,680
we think as as facts

1878
01:05:01,589 --> 01:04:59,839
there's a lot we still have yet to learn

1879
01:05:02,390 --> 01:05:01,599
and i think the way he is approaching

1880
01:05:05,430 --> 01:05:02,400
this

1881
01:05:07,109 --> 01:05:05,440
particularly using using some technology

1882
01:05:10,470 --> 01:05:07,119
and telescopes

1883
01:05:12,150 --> 01:05:10,480
wide field telescopes is a great start

1884
01:05:13,430 --> 01:05:12,160
because look he only has to be right one

1885
01:05:17,270 --> 01:05:13,440
time

1886
01:05:19,750 --> 01:05:17,280
nobel prize for it if he's right

1887
01:05:21,750 --> 01:05:19,760
you know so so that's a big deal and you

1888
01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:21,760
have to be able to take risks

1889
01:05:26,309 --> 01:05:24,000
that's what the pursuit of real science

1890
01:05:28,870 --> 01:05:26,319
is all about it's about risks

1891
01:05:31,190 --> 01:05:28,880
it's about asking the hard questions

1892
01:05:33,029 --> 01:05:31,200
and and you know sometimes

1893
01:05:34,950 --> 01:05:33,039
the answer may not be necessarily very

1894
01:05:36,390 --> 01:05:34,960
convenient but it turns out to be the

1895
01:05:38,710 --> 01:05:36,400
truth

1896
01:05:40,710 --> 01:05:38,720
so that's that would be my

1897
01:05:43,029 --> 01:05:40,720
that would be my uh my two cents

1898
01:05:44,710 --> 01:05:43,039
regarding regarding avi love and the

1899
01:05:46,309 --> 01:05:44,720
galileo project i wish we had more

1900
01:05:48,069 --> 01:05:46,319
scientists like abby to be honest with

1901
01:05:49,990 --> 01:05:48,079
you

1902
01:05:51,670 --> 01:05:50,000
we interviewed avi loeb just two weeks

1903
01:05:53,510 --> 01:05:51,680
ago so if people haven't heard that go

1904
01:05:55,829 --> 01:05:53,520
back and check it out but yeah i'm sure

1905
01:05:57,270 --> 01:05:55,839
if galileo had social media back in his

1906
01:05:59,589 --> 01:05:57,280
day the abuse he would have gotten would

1907
01:06:01,109 --> 01:05:59,599
have driven him off social media as well

1908
01:06:02,950 --> 01:06:01,119
i can appreciate that

1909
01:06:05,430 --> 01:06:02,960
yeah i guess to some degree he's

1910
01:06:08,390 --> 01:06:05,440
probably pretty lucky there it wasn't

1911
01:06:11,029 --> 01:06:08,400
twitter twitter back then

1912
01:06:12,710 --> 01:06:11,039
yeah um gary nolan professor gary nolan

1913
01:06:14,390 --> 01:06:12,720
like i say is coming on the podcast in a

1914
01:06:15,910 --> 01:06:14,400
few weeks i'm honored with that he

1915
01:06:18,549 --> 01:06:15,920
doesn't do too many interviews he's a

1916
01:06:20,470 --> 01:06:18,559
very very busy man um he mentioned on

1917
01:06:22,390 --> 01:06:20,480
cut joy mungo theories of everything

1918
01:06:25,029 --> 01:06:22,400
which happened that came out just last

1919
01:06:27,109 --> 01:06:25,039
week um we need an organization we can

1920
01:06:29,190 --> 01:06:27,119
turn to who can vet the data i'm

1921
01:06:31,109 --> 01:06:29,200
involved with luella zondo and others

1922
01:06:32,630 --> 01:06:31,119
trying to set that up is that something

1923
01:06:33,990 --> 01:06:32,640
you can elaborate on and speak on that

1924
01:06:35,670 --> 01:06:34,000
organization

1925
01:06:37,990 --> 01:06:35,680
i mean you say yourself gary's an

1926
01:06:40,309 --> 01:06:38,000
incredible human being i mean

1927
01:06:42,150 --> 01:06:40,319
really really impressive you know i it's

1928
01:06:43,349 --> 01:06:42,160
funny because i went to school to be a

1929
01:06:46,309 --> 01:06:43,359
uh

1930
01:06:48,870 --> 01:06:46,319
microbiology immunology and parasitology

1931
01:06:51,990 --> 01:06:50,710
the science and mathematic fields

1932
01:06:53,670 --> 01:06:52,000
and then you meet someone like gary

1933
01:06:56,309 --> 01:06:53,680
who's actually been nominated for the

1934
01:06:57,829 --> 01:06:56,319
nobel prize in immunology

1935
01:07:00,710 --> 01:06:57,839
um

1936
01:07:03,990 --> 01:07:00,720
you know it's it's it's pretty pretty

1937
01:07:05,829 --> 01:07:04,000
incredible um

1938
01:07:08,069 --> 01:07:05,839
having him on board is a blessing you

1939
01:07:10,549 --> 01:07:08,079
know he's he has been very helpful in

1940
01:07:12,230 --> 01:07:10,559
the past in this effort in this endeavor

1941
01:07:14,950 --> 01:07:12,240
he's precisely the type of skill set

1942
01:07:16,870 --> 01:07:14,960
that we need and yes i am working with

1943
01:07:19,829 --> 01:07:16,880
with gary nolan

1944
01:07:22,309 --> 01:07:19,839
and others by the way to create uh

1945
01:07:25,029 --> 01:07:22,319
advisory boards um academic advisory

1946
01:07:27,430 --> 01:07:25,039
boards if you will or think tanks uh and

1947
01:07:28,950 --> 01:07:27,440
scientific think tanks that can

1948
01:07:30,390 --> 01:07:28,960
um

1949
01:07:32,470 --> 01:07:30,400
you know do a lot of the heavy lifting

1950
01:07:34,870 --> 01:07:32,480
right get the have have the conversation

1951
01:07:37,270 --> 01:07:34,880
in a way that that is meaningful that's

1952
01:07:39,750 --> 01:07:37,280
informative uh and

1953
01:07:42,950 --> 01:07:39,760
headshot helps shed some light

1954
01:07:44,870 --> 01:07:42,960
on this topic um and you know all i can

1955
01:07:45,829 --> 01:07:44,880
say is i'm blessed that gary's part of

1956
01:07:48,069 --> 01:07:45,839
the team

1957
01:07:49,990 --> 01:07:48,079
uh we have other very very smart people

1958
01:07:51,109 --> 01:07:50,000
as well that are part of the team they

1959
01:07:53,190 --> 01:07:51,119
haven't given me permission to share

1960
01:07:54,870 --> 01:07:53,200
their name so i won't yet

1961
01:07:56,390 --> 01:07:54,880
uh but i think people will be really

1962
01:07:57,430 --> 01:07:56,400
impressed when they when they finally

1963
01:08:00,309 --> 01:07:57,440
see

1964
01:08:02,069 --> 01:08:00,319
these these these

1965
01:08:05,349 --> 01:08:02,079
endeavors uh

1966
01:08:07,029 --> 01:08:05,359
finalize and and and come to fruition

1967
01:08:08,549 --> 01:08:07,039
people will be surprised to see the the

1968
01:08:10,710 --> 01:08:08,559
type of caliber of individuals that are

1969
01:08:12,230 --> 01:08:10,720
that are on these these boards um

1970
01:08:15,109 --> 01:08:12,240
you know look i i'll be the first one to

1971
01:08:18,390 --> 01:08:15,119
say i'm i i've deliberately taken myself

1972
01:08:20,709 --> 01:08:18,400
out of uh other than setting it up uh

1973
01:08:23,110 --> 01:08:20,719
any role of of being on these boards

1974
01:08:25,910 --> 01:08:23,120
because i don't have the qualifications

1975
01:08:29,269 --> 01:08:25,920
and i know that you know it's i'm not uh

1976
01:08:31,669 --> 01:08:29,279
i i i don't have a phd in in the areas

1977
01:08:33,749 --> 01:08:31,679
that are necessary you know i'm not uh

1978
01:08:35,510 --> 01:08:33,759
and i don't claim to you know we need we

1979
01:08:37,349 --> 01:08:35,520
need the right people for these jobs and

1980
01:08:39,030 --> 01:08:37,359
i also know my limitations i know that

1981
01:08:41,430 --> 01:08:39,040
i'm not the right person

1982
01:08:43,910 --> 01:08:41,440
for for those jobs i'm not doing it out

1983
01:08:45,749 --> 01:08:43,920
of pride and ego sure i probably could

1984
01:08:47,349 --> 01:08:45,759
shoehorn myself into one of those

1985
01:08:49,510 --> 01:08:47,359
positions but

1986
01:08:51,269 --> 01:08:49,520
for what i would just be a distraction

1987
01:08:52,950 --> 01:08:51,279
because i don't have the necessary the

1988
01:08:55,669 --> 01:08:52,960
requisite skill sets

1989
01:08:57,110 --> 01:08:55,679
uh for for these positions i i am smart

1990
01:08:58,950 --> 01:08:57,120
enough to know that we have a need for

1991
01:09:01,590 --> 01:08:58,960
them but i'm not smart enough to

1992
01:09:02,709 --> 01:09:01,600
actually do it um to actually be in that

1993
01:09:04,390 --> 01:09:02,719
role and so

1994
01:09:06,070 --> 01:09:04,400
uh gary's one of the few people who

1995
01:09:07,749 --> 01:09:06,080
actually is smart enough to be to be in

1996
01:09:09,189 --> 01:09:07,759
one of those roles and we're working

1997
01:09:12,550 --> 01:09:09,199
very hard to

1998
01:09:15,349 --> 01:09:12,560
to to formalize some of these um

1999
01:09:17,269 --> 01:09:15,359
some of these endeavors

2000
01:09:18,870 --> 01:09:17,279
is there any time scale as to when the

2001
01:09:20,789 --> 01:09:18,880
public people like myself are going to

2002
01:09:23,430 --> 01:09:20,799
find out about these endeavors in a more

2003
01:09:25,189 --> 01:09:23,440
formal way yeah yeah hopefully soon i

2004
01:09:26,630 --> 01:09:25,199
mean there's some there's some hurdles

2005
01:09:27,910 --> 01:09:26,640
still and some some things that we have

2006
01:09:29,030 --> 01:09:27,920
to do you know anytime you set up

2007
01:09:30,630 --> 01:09:29,040
something like this there's legal

2008
01:09:32,470 --> 01:09:30,640
hurdles and you've got

2009
01:09:34,149 --> 01:09:32,480
corporate hurdles you've got funding

2010
01:09:36,390 --> 01:09:34,159
hurdles and you've got you know

2011
01:09:37,910 --> 01:09:36,400
secretariat hurdles and administrative

2012
01:09:39,510 --> 01:09:37,920
hurdles i mean

2013
01:09:41,110 --> 01:09:39,520
this isn't just snap your fingers and it

2014
01:09:43,910 --> 01:09:41,120
happens you know people people tend to

2015
01:09:46,149 --> 01:09:43,920
think that oh you know this is fun work

2016
01:09:47,910 --> 01:09:46,159
it's not it's exhausting it's real work

2017
01:09:49,829 --> 01:09:47,920
man it's real a lot of a lot of effort

2018
01:09:51,430 --> 01:09:49,839
has to go into this and a lot of a lot

2019
01:09:53,510 --> 01:09:51,440
of brain power to set this up right

2020
01:09:55,030 --> 01:09:53,520
because if you set it up wrong then you

2021
01:09:56,950 --> 01:09:55,040
know four or five years down the road

2022
01:09:58,709 --> 01:09:56,960
you're really gonna find yourself

2023
01:10:01,030 --> 01:09:58,719
suffering the consequences so so it's

2024
01:10:04,070 --> 01:10:01,040
better to do a little bit extra footwork

2025
01:10:06,149 --> 01:10:04,080
and homework up front to to make these

2026
01:10:08,709 --> 01:10:06,159
these organizations to set them up

2027
01:10:10,149 --> 01:10:08,719
correctly and allow them to be enduring

2028
01:10:12,390 --> 01:10:10,159
and to to

2029
01:10:13,590 --> 01:10:12,400
to not just be a layer of bureaucracy

2030
01:10:16,229 --> 01:10:13,600
right we don't need another layer of

2031
01:10:19,510 --> 01:10:16,239
bureaucracy but we need our results we

2032
01:10:20,950 --> 01:10:19,520
need we need we need findings and so

2033
01:10:23,510 --> 01:10:20,960
that's what these organizations are

2034
01:10:25,030 --> 01:10:23,520
being set up to do look i've said

2035
01:10:27,189 --> 01:10:25,040
this shouldn't be a secret to anybody

2036
01:10:28,870 --> 01:10:27,199
because i gave a briefing and i even

2037
01:10:32,149 --> 01:10:28,880
shared those briefing slides when i went

2038
01:10:34,310 --> 01:10:32,159
to italy and and then re-shared them on

2039
01:10:36,070 --> 01:10:34,320
a podcast

2040
01:10:38,310 --> 01:10:36,080
i mean i i've been saying this was going

2041
01:10:40,229 --> 01:10:38,320
to happen for the last six seven months

2042
01:10:41,910 --> 01:10:40,239
i actually have a diagram where i showed

2043
01:10:43,189 --> 01:10:41,920
you know what a national lab might look

2044
01:10:45,590 --> 01:10:43,199
like and all these little branches

2045
01:10:47,669 --> 01:10:45,600
coming out um

2046
01:10:49,430 --> 01:10:47,679
you know i i

2047
01:10:52,310 --> 01:10:49,440
i kind of hinted at this for for some

2048
01:10:56,149 --> 01:10:54,070
just before we get to listener questions

2049
01:10:57,910 --> 01:10:56,159
to finish off because i've got so many

2050
01:10:59,590 --> 01:10:57,920
and i want to at least ask a few of them

2051
01:11:02,229 --> 01:10:59,600
i want to ask you one more question for

2052
01:11:04,470 --> 01:11:02,239
myself um the day you get to ride off

2053
01:11:05,669 --> 01:11:04,480
into your sunset satisfied your work is

2054
01:11:07,669 --> 01:11:05,679
finally done

2055
01:11:09,510 --> 01:11:07,679
what do you hope to have accomplished

2056
01:11:12,070 --> 01:11:09,520
gosh you know people have already told

2057
01:11:13,910 --> 01:11:12,080
me i'm there i could do it tomorrow

2058
01:11:15,910 --> 01:11:13,920
could do it today i mean mission

2059
01:11:17,510 --> 01:11:15,920
accomplished we got we got the topic

2060
01:11:19,189 --> 01:11:17,520
elevated to the point now where it's

2061
01:11:21,910 --> 01:11:19,199
it's been acknowledged by

2062
01:11:23,990 --> 01:11:21,920
by by former directors of cia and former

2063
01:11:25,750 --> 01:11:24,000
presidents and current sitting members

2064
01:11:26,550 --> 01:11:25,760
of congress and we actually have a law i

2065
01:11:28,550 --> 01:11:26,560
mean

2066
01:11:31,990 --> 01:11:28,560
in theory i could walk away now

2067
01:11:36,229 --> 01:11:34,470
i'm concerned that we we're still not

2068
01:11:39,510 --> 01:11:36,239
where we need to be

2069
01:11:43,430 --> 01:11:39,520
and this topic doesn't backslide because

2070
01:11:47,669 --> 01:11:44,709
engaged

2071
01:11:49,430 --> 01:11:47,679
then we fall

2072
01:11:51,030 --> 01:11:49,440
victim to the potential that this could

2073
01:11:52,950 --> 01:11:51,040
be be

2074
01:11:54,390 --> 01:11:52,960
in five years relegated too well we did

2075
01:11:55,590 --> 01:11:54,400
our due diligence nothing to see here

2076
01:11:57,590 --> 01:11:55,600
folks right

2077
01:11:59,350 --> 01:11:57,600
i don't want another blue book

2078
01:12:00,870 --> 01:11:59,360
that's that's not the intent of this we

2079
01:12:03,189 --> 01:12:00,880
put too much effort into this just to

2080
01:12:04,630 --> 01:12:03,199
have this die on the vine because it

2081
01:12:07,270 --> 01:12:04,640
lost momentum

2082
01:12:08,790 --> 01:12:07,280
so um

2083
01:12:13,750 --> 01:12:08,800
you know what it looks like for me is

2084
01:12:17,350 --> 01:12:15,030
when we know everything we've done in

2085
01:12:20,310 --> 01:12:17,360
the past

2086
01:12:22,550 --> 01:12:20,320
the american people uh are are satisfied

2087
01:12:24,229 --> 01:12:22,560
with that

2088
01:12:25,430 --> 01:12:24,239
they've had some of their questions

2089
01:12:27,110 --> 01:12:25,440
answered

2090
01:12:28,229 --> 01:12:27,120
and we have a deliberate plan to move

2091
01:12:30,630 --> 01:12:28,239
forward

2092
01:12:34,630 --> 01:12:30,640
on this topic uh in a way that is

2093
01:12:37,189 --> 01:12:34,640
endearing and informative and insightful

2094
01:12:39,110 --> 01:12:37,199
and responsible right and i think we

2095
01:12:40,630 --> 01:12:39,120
need to have the conversation truly at

2096
01:12:43,110 --> 01:12:40,640
the international level have some

2097
01:12:45,669 --> 01:12:43,120
international bodies involved and at

2098
01:12:47,430 --> 01:12:45,679
that point i feel that i've done all i

2099
01:12:50,790 --> 01:12:47,440
can do

2100
01:12:52,550 --> 01:12:50,800
i think i can still do more to help

2101
01:12:54,790 --> 01:12:52,560
hopefully anyways you know

2102
01:12:56,229 --> 01:12:54,800
do i do i want to no i don't i'm

2103
01:12:58,229 --> 01:12:56,239
exhausted tired

2104
01:13:00,470 --> 01:12:58,239
but but

2105
01:13:02,709 --> 01:13:00,480
do i feel the need to yeah i do

2106
01:13:04,390 --> 01:13:02,719
i do my mission isn't complete yet it's

2107
01:13:06,550 --> 01:13:04,400
not i wish it was

2108
01:13:08,709 --> 01:13:06,560
like i said it's been a long

2109
01:13:09,669 --> 01:13:08,719
long road so far for me and for my

2110
01:13:11,750 --> 01:13:09,679
family

2111
01:13:13,510 --> 01:13:11,760
but um

2112
01:13:15,750 --> 01:13:13,520
it's it's too important too important of

2113
01:13:17,750 --> 01:13:15,760
a mission you know it's

2114
01:13:19,270 --> 01:13:17,760
we're running a long marathon it's a

2115
01:13:21,350 --> 01:13:19,280
relay race and i'm waiting for someone

2116
01:13:23,750 --> 01:13:21,360
to pick up the baton

2117
01:13:25,669 --> 01:13:23,760
that won't drop it right or or get lazy

2118
01:13:27,910 --> 01:13:25,679
and get tired and say yeah i don't feel

2119
01:13:29,830 --> 01:13:27,920
like running anymore no no you have to

2120
01:13:31,350 --> 01:13:29,840
whoever picks up this baton you

2121
01:13:33,669 --> 01:13:31,360
you gotta run till someone else takes it

2122
01:13:34,870 --> 01:13:33,679
from your hand you know you're stuck

2123
01:13:38,229 --> 01:13:34,880
with it once it's kind of like the old

2124
01:13:39,669 --> 01:13:38,239
uh what is it the old pottery barn uh

2125
01:13:41,350 --> 01:13:39,679
saying when you go to pottery barn you

2126
01:13:43,910 --> 01:13:41,360
know if you break it you bought it

2127
01:13:45,910 --> 01:13:43,920
so once that baton is in your hand you

2128
01:13:47,189 --> 01:13:45,920
you own it man got to carry it and you

2129
01:13:49,350 --> 01:13:47,199
got to carry it

2130
01:13:50,709 --> 01:13:49,360
to the end and you know who knows how

2131
01:13:52,310 --> 01:13:50,719
long that is you got to carry till

2132
01:13:53,910 --> 01:13:52,320
someone

2133
01:13:56,229 --> 01:13:53,920
takes it from you right it's just like

2134
01:13:58,070 --> 01:13:56,239
in the army you know when you how long

2135
01:13:59,510 --> 01:13:58,080
do you guard your post well as long as

2136
01:14:01,030 --> 01:13:59,520
you're told to you know until someone

2137
01:14:03,270 --> 01:14:01,040
else comes up and relieves you of that

2138
01:14:05,350 --> 01:14:03,280
responsibility that's your post you you

2139
01:14:06,870 --> 01:14:05,360
stay and you guard it until that relief

2140
01:14:10,149 --> 01:14:06,880
comes and if release never comes and you

2141
01:14:13,350 --> 01:14:11,669
lou i'm going to go right into the deep

2142
01:14:14,950 --> 01:14:13,360
end with listener questions and thank

2143
01:14:16,709 --> 01:14:14,960
you to everyone who sent over i'm not

2144
01:14:18,470 --> 01:14:16,719
exaggerating when i say there was about

2145
01:14:20,870 --> 01:14:18,480
three to four hundred questions

2146
01:14:23,270 --> 01:14:20,880
submitted to lou of which i did read

2147
01:14:24,709 --> 01:14:23,280
every one of them and uh hopefully in

2148
01:14:27,030 --> 01:14:24,719
some way your question's been answered

2149
01:14:28,790 --> 01:14:27,040
in the body of the interview um or it'll

2150
01:14:31,750 --> 01:14:28,800
get answered in future in some way shape

2151
01:14:33,270 --> 01:14:31,760
or form first up jason in los angeles

2152
01:14:35,510 --> 01:14:33,280
lou if you remember last time you were

2153
01:14:37,669 --> 01:14:35,520
on the podcast with me you very candidly

2154
01:14:40,070 --> 01:14:37,679
share details of your mother's passing

2155
01:14:42,550 --> 01:14:40,080
and jason wants to know do you believe

2156
01:14:44,229 --> 01:14:42,560
the inevitable process of human death

2157
01:14:45,669 --> 01:14:44,239
is in any way connected to the

2158
01:14:47,189 --> 01:14:45,679
phenomenon

2159
01:14:49,510 --> 01:14:47,199
ooh

2160
01:14:52,550 --> 01:14:49,520
i have no idea um you know like i said

2161
01:14:54,470 --> 01:14:52,560
we live in a in a wondrous and and huge

2162
01:14:56,470 --> 01:14:54,480
universe i guess anything's possible

2163
01:14:57,990 --> 01:14:56,480
really

2164
01:15:00,630 --> 01:14:58,000
you know death

2165
01:15:01,910 --> 01:15:00,640
i've been around death enough

2166
01:15:03,189 --> 01:15:01,920
probably too much

2167
01:15:05,110 --> 01:15:03,199
where

2168
01:15:06,470 --> 01:15:05,120
what i've learned is that death is a is

2169
01:15:08,870 --> 01:15:06,480
a process

2170
01:15:11,750 --> 01:15:08,880
death is a transition

2171
01:15:14,550 --> 01:15:11,760
death is not an event it is a transition

2172
01:15:17,189 --> 01:15:14,560
just like birth it's a transition

2173
01:15:19,189 --> 01:15:17,199
coming into one reality and then

2174
01:15:22,390 --> 01:15:19,199
crossing over that threshold into

2175
01:15:25,750 --> 01:15:22,400
something else an unknown but but but

2176
01:15:27,430 --> 01:15:25,760
still something else um

2177
01:15:30,470 --> 01:15:27,440
i don't know

2178
01:15:33,270 --> 01:15:30,480
the relationship that if any regarding

2179
01:15:35,270 --> 01:15:33,280
uap i guess it's anybody's guess

2180
01:15:36,870 --> 01:15:35,280
could be um

2181
01:15:39,110 --> 01:15:36,880
you know but then we get into

2182
01:15:40,310 --> 01:15:39,120
potentially the discussion of you know

2183
01:15:42,630 --> 01:15:40,320
some some

2184
01:15:44,630 --> 01:15:42,640
theological principles such as angels

2185
01:15:46,790 --> 01:15:44,640
and demons and things like that

2186
01:15:48,709 --> 01:15:46,800
um i i don't think we

2187
01:15:50,149 --> 01:15:48,719
we know enough yet i mean certainly some

2188
01:15:52,149 --> 01:15:50,159
people in the pentagon when i was in the

2189
01:15:54,310 --> 01:15:52,159
pentagon wasn't very afraid was afraid

2190
01:15:57,270 --> 01:15:54,320
of the topic because of that very very

2191
01:15:58,310 --> 01:15:57,280
issue that that that connection

2192
01:16:00,070 --> 01:15:58,320
um

2193
01:16:01,750 --> 01:16:00,080
you know i i

2194
01:16:03,750 --> 01:16:01,760
i just don't think we have enough data

2195
01:16:05,990 --> 01:16:03,760
right now to substantiate to

2196
01:16:07,350 --> 01:16:06,000
substantiate that i wouldn't you know i

2197
01:16:08,709 --> 01:16:07,360
wouldn't be surprised either way if it

2198
01:16:09,990 --> 01:16:08,719
does or doesn't

2199
01:16:10,870 --> 01:16:10,000
um

2200
01:16:12,870 --> 01:16:10,880
you know

2201
01:16:14,630 --> 01:16:12,880
but i i

2202
01:16:15,990 --> 01:16:14,640
i think um

2203
01:16:18,709 --> 01:16:16,000
i think we have a long way to go before

2204
01:16:21,669 --> 01:16:19,990
definitively answer that question

2205
01:16:23,910 --> 01:16:21,679
because because

2206
01:16:26,070 --> 01:16:23,920
death is such an unknown and uaps are

2207
01:16:27,590 --> 01:16:26,080
such an unknown right that that are the

2208
01:16:29,110 --> 01:16:27,600
two connected well the one way they are

2209
01:16:31,350 --> 01:16:29,120
connected is that we really don't know

2210
01:16:33,350 --> 01:16:31,360
very much about either one so

2211
01:16:34,550 --> 01:16:33,360
that's that's for certain uh but is

2212
01:16:36,630 --> 01:16:34,560
there a

2213
01:16:39,590 --> 01:16:36,640
more intimate connection between the two

2214
01:16:44,390 --> 01:16:42,070
the next question from jack burton jack

2215
01:16:47,270 --> 01:16:44,400
asks lou during or since your time with

2216
01:16:51,669 --> 01:16:47,280
atep are you aware of any loss of human

2217
01:16:59,189 --> 01:16:53,910
wow i gotta be really careful with that

2218
01:17:02,950 --> 01:17:00,790
i'm gonna have to pass on that question

2219
01:17:05,750 --> 01:17:02,960
respectfully there's no way i can answer

2220
01:17:07,189 --> 01:17:05,760
that question without

2221
01:17:09,910 --> 01:17:07,199
yeah i can't i can't get into that

2222
01:17:11,510 --> 01:17:09,920
question right now i'm sorry

2223
01:17:13,510 --> 01:17:11,520
let me follow up with another listener

2224
01:17:15,510 --> 01:17:13,520
question lou but it's along similar

2225
01:17:17,990 --> 01:17:15,520
lines but potentially

2226
01:17:20,310 --> 01:17:18,000
less of a direct human impact um mr

2227
01:17:22,950 --> 01:17:20,320
calhoun asks can lu elaborate whether

2228
01:17:25,590 --> 01:17:22,960
different parts of aircraft during close

2229
01:17:29,350 --> 01:17:25,600
encounters with uaps were subject to

2230
01:17:33,510 --> 01:17:29,360
varying degrees of damage oh wow

2231
01:17:37,510 --> 01:17:35,189
let me answer this there's there's

2232
01:17:40,950 --> 01:17:37,520
there's information to suggest that that

2233
01:17:43,590 --> 01:17:40,960
avionics can be interfered with um we've

2234
01:17:45,750 --> 01:17:43,600
seen it with uh

2235
01:17:48,070 --> 01:17:45,760
rotary wing uh helicopters and we've

2236
01:17:49,910 --> 01:17:48,080
seen it with fixed-wing aircraft

2237
01:17:51,110 --> 01:17:49,920
where there seems to be some sort of

2238
01:17:53,430 --> 01:17:51,120
interference we don't know if it's

2239
01:17:55,830 --> 01:17:53,440
delivered or not but they're there some

2240
01:18:00,310 --> 01:17:55,840
cases aircraft have lost power

2241
01:18:02,630 --> 01:18:00,320
uh in other cases uh aircraft have um

2242
01:18:05,030 --> 01:18:02,640
seemed to physically have have

2243
01:18:06,149 --> 01:18:05,040
stopped believe it or not in midair

2244
01:18:06,870 --> 01:18:06,159
um

2245
01:18:07,669 --> 01:18:06,880
so

2246
01:18:13,590 --> 01:18:07,679
uh

2247
01:18:18,070 --> 01:18:15,830
um john wants to know is there any

2248
01:18:20,630 --> 01:18:18,080
understanding of the best conditions for

2249
01:18:22,390 --> 01:18:20,640
these craft to fly around or function

2250
01:18:24,550 --> 01:18:22,400
and for me to add on to that lou i've

2251
01:18:27,030 --> 01:18:24,560
always been very interested that as as

2252
01:18:29,270 --> 01:18:27,040
fast as these objects can go through the

2253
01:18:32,070 --> 01:18:29,280
air they still seem to slow down

2254
01:18:34,310 --> 01:18:32,080
considerably underwater even though they

2255
01:18:35,110 --> 01:18:34,320
go faster much faster than anything we

2256
01:18:37,430 --> 01:18:35,120
have

2257
01:18:38,830 --> 01:18:37,440
yeah well actually underwater is funny

2258
01:18:41,910 --> 01:18:38,840
you say that

2259
01:18:44,390 --> 01:18:41,920
because um

2260
01:18:46,229 --> 01:18:44,400
you know we're using radar a lot of

2261
01:18:49,110 --> 01:18:46,239
times to see things in the air

2262
01:18:50,470 --> 01:18:49,120
and radar is an electromagnetic um

2263
01:18:51,990 --> 01:18:50,480
energy wave

2264
01:18:52,709 --> 01:18:52,000
that is traveling

2265
01:18:55,030 --> 01:18:52,719
at

2266
01:18:57,030 --> 01:18:55,040
roughly the speed of light right

2267
01:18:59,350 --> 01:18:57,040
the problem is underwater you have to

2268
01:19:01,189 --> 01:18:59,360
use acoustics radar really doesn't work

2269
01:19:03,830 --> 01:19:01,199
you have to use sonar

2270
01:19:06,630 --> 01:19:03,840
and sonar is limited by the speed of

2271
01:19:07,590 --> 01:19:06,640
sound underwater which is fast

2272
01:19:10,149 --> 01:19:07,600
but

2273
01:19:11,590 --> 01:19:10,159
it's not that fast and so so it could

2274
01:19:13,830 --> 01:19:11,600
very well be the reason why we see these

2275
01:19:15,270 --> 01:19:13,840
things moving slower underwater is not

2276
01:19:16,229 --> 01:19:15,280
because they're actually moving slower

2277
01:19:18,310 --> 01:19:16,239
because those are the only ones when

2278
01:19:20,950 --> 01:19:18,320
they're moving that slowly see

2279
01:19:23,430 --> 01:19:20,960
in essence c with with sonar or here if

2280
01:19:24,950 --> 01:19:23,440
you will really more accurate um if a

2281
01:19:28,229 --> 01:19:24,960
vehicle is moving

2282
01:19:30,310 --> 01:19:28,239
fast enough sonar won't catch up to it

2283
01:19:31,750 --> 01:19:30,320
so so in essence you're not going to see

2284
01:19:32,950 --> 01:19:31,760
that it's not going to hear those you're

2285
01:19:36,149 --> 01:19:32,960
not going to be able to detect those

2286
01:19:37,990 --> 01:19:36,159
because because the the the

2287
01:19:40,790 --> 01:19:38,000
the way sonar works you have a ping and

2288
01:19:42,390 --> 01:19:40,800
that ping sent out an acoustic signature

2289
01:19:43,990 --> 01:19:42,400
out into the water it hits something

2290
01:19:46,470 --> 01:19:44,000
reflects back and comes back very much

2291
01:19:47,830 --> 01:19:46,480
like like a bat uses sonar and whales

2292
01:19:49,750 --> 01:19:47,840
and dolphins

2293
01:19:53,189 --> 01:19:49,760
but there's limitations because again

2294
01:19:54,790 --> 01:19:53,199
sound can only travel so fast underwater

2295
01:19:57,110 --> 01:19:54,800
um there was a really interesting

2296
01:19:59,110 --> 01:19:57,120
experiment done back in the 60s

2297
01:20:01,030 --> 01:19:59,120
and uh forgive me if i don't have all

2298
01:20:02,470 --> 01:20:01,040
the details correct so it's been a long

2299
01:20:05,030 --> 01:20:02,480
time since i heard about this but they

2300
01:20:06,550 --> 01:20:05,040
were dropping death charges

2301
01:20:09,430 --> 01:20:06,560
uh to to

2302
01:20:11,510 --> 01:20:09,440
in the 60s off the coast of uh they're

2303
01:20:14,070 --> 01:20:11,520
in the caribbean i'm not mistaken and

2304
01:20:16,149 --> 01:20:14,080
they're trying to see how far sound

2305
01:20:19,189 --> 01:20:16,159
waves would travel under water

2306
01:20:22,070 --> 01:20:19,199
and there were these um you know these

2307
01:20:24,709 --> 01:20:22,080
these these sub-aquatic channels if you

2308
01:20:26,709 --> 01:20:24,719
will uh like like canyons underwater

2309
01:20:27,910 --> 01:20:26,719
sound waves we travel you know long very

2310
01:20:29,750 --> 01:20:27,920
long distance

2311
01:20:33,910 --> 01:20:29,760
and i think it was

2312
01:20:35,990 --> 01:20:33,920
like within 12 hours they picked up uh

2313
01:20:37,830 --> 01:20:36,000
one of these acoustic signatures off the

2314
01:20:39,110 --> 01:20:37,840
coast of australia or something like

2315
01:20:40,950 --> 01:20:39,120
that again please don't hold me to it i

2316
01:20:43,110 --> 01:20:40,960
don't know but it was some remarkable

2317
01:20:44,550 --> 01:20:43,120
distance you know halfway around the

2318
01:20:47,350 --> 01:20:44,560
world uh

2319
01:20:50,310 --> 01:20:47,360
they picked up these signatures

2320
01:20:52,229 --> 01:20:50,320
but that's still not you know 13 000

2321
01:20:53,669 --> 01:20:52,239
miles an hour 10 000 miles an hour my

2322
01:20:56,149 --> 01:20:53,679
point being is that that there's

2323
01:20:58,629 --> 01:20:56,159
limitations to sonar underwater

2324
01:21:00,310 --> 01:20:58,639
so we don't know if things really do go

2325
01:21:02,310 --> 01:21:00,320
slower underwater or if that's just the

2326
01:21:04,229 --> 01:21:02,320
limitations of our own technology and

2327
01:21:06,229 --> 01:21:04,239
that's why we're not picking up anything

2328
01:21:09,110 --> 01:21:06,239
beyond maybe eight nine hundred knots

2329
01:21:13,830 --> 01:21:11,910
interesting um fred asks that in a

2330
01:21:15,990 --> 01:21:13,840
recent interview on martin willis

2331
01:21:18,629 --> 01:21:16,000
podcast ufo you were asked about the

2332
01:21:20,629 --> 01:21:18,639
aerial school incident and you responded

2333
01:21:22,470 --> 01:21:20,639
there was some unknown and compelling

2334
01:21:24,870 --> 01:21:22,480
information about the event can you

2335
01:21:26,070 --> 01:21:24,880
elaborate i cannot right now someone

2336
01:21:27,830 --> 01:21:26,080
else is going to

2337
01:21:30,470 --> 01:21:27,840
provide that um i've been asked

2338
01:21:32,790 --> 01:21:30,480
respectfully not to discuss it um that

2339
01:21:34,629 --> 01:21:32,800
information will be forthcoming uh in a

2340
01:21:37,430 --> 01:21:34,639
very public way for some from people for

2341
01:21:39,830 --> 01:21:37,440
the consumers um i i so a lot of respect

2342
01:21:41,350 --> 01:21:39,840
for for some friends and colleagues i'm

2343
01:21:42,950 --> 01:21:41,360
not gonna elaborate on it the good news

2344
01:21:43,990 --> 01:21:42,960
is that you're going to probably get a

2345
01:21:51,350 --> 01:21:44,000
full

2346
01:21:53,350 --> 01:21:51,360
so yeah i'll leave it at that

2347
01:21:55,030 --> 01:21:53,360
i know there's one or two productions uh

2348
01:21:56,629 --> 01:21:55,040
in the pipeline to come out so hopefully

2349
01:21:58,390 --> 01:21:56,639
if it's one of those that would be great

2350
01:22:00,870 --> 01:21:58,400
that we're going to get to see that i i

2351
01:22:02,709 --> 01:22:00,880
i suspected

2352
01:22:06,229 --> 01:22:02,719
yeah that's good to hear

2353
01:22:09,110 --> 01:22:06,239
josh asks did atip specifically ever

2354
01:22:13,030 --> 01:22:09,120
prepare any formal reports for the dod

2355
01:22:14,709 --> 01:22:13,040
or dia yeah absolutely we did a lot

2356
01:22:18,149 --> 01:22:14,719
yeah i mean there's there's reports

2357
01:22:20,149 --> 01:22:18,159
there um you know i i i can't force dia

2358
01:22:22,390 --> 01:22:20,159
or dod to release them but those reports

2359
01:22:24,310 --> 01:22:22,400
are there and then you know

2360
01:22:26,310 --> 01:22:24,320
with enough scratching i'm sure the ig

2361
01:22:27,910 --> 01:22:26,320
is aware of it uh you know i wouldn't be

2362
01:22:29,350 --> 01:22:27,920
surprised if they have copies of some of

2363
01:22:31,510 --> 01:22:29,360
those reports but yeah

2364
01:22:33,350 --> 01:22:31,520
absolutely

2365
01:22:34,790 --> 01:22:33,360
i think what josh is getting at as well

2366
01:22:37,750 --> 01:22:34,800
is the idea that

2367
01:22:39,030 --> 01:22:37,760
as other documents still to be fired and

2368
01:22:40,790 --> 01:22:39,040
that doesn't have to be by one

2369
01:22:41,830 --> 01:22:40,800
individual who seems to fire everything

2370
01:22:44,229 --> 01:22:41,840
himself

2371
01:22:45,910 --> 01:22:44,239
that other people could be requesting

2372
01:22:47,750 --> 01:22:45,920
that haven't seen the light of day yeah

2373
01:22:48,390 --> 01:22:47,760
there's a lot but but you can fly that

2374
01:22:50,550 --> 01:22:48,400
doesn't mean they're going to be

2375
01:22:52,550 --> 01:22:50,560
released i mean there's there's a

2376
01:22:54,629 --> 01:22:52,560
tranche of information and data that

2377
01:22:56,470 --> 01:22:54,639
that is not being released people like

2378
01:22:59,030 --> 01:22:56,480
oh well they don't have it before they

2379
01:22:59,910 --> 01:22:59,040
said you know nothing to see here well

2380
01:23:05,030 --> 01:22:59,920
that's

2381
01:23:07,669 --> 01:23:05,040
saying look you know

2382
01:23:10,550 --> 01:23:07,679
foy is good but it has its limitations

2383
01:23:13,110 --> 01:23:10,560
there is a lot of information available

2384
01:23:16,550 --> 01:23:13,120
uh that is is is not going to be found

2385
01:23:18,310 --> 01:23:16,560
with foia i'll just i'll just say that

2386
01:23:21,110 --> 01:23:18,320
and that's the issue with foia in that

2387
01:23:23,590 --> 01:23:21,120
sense lou that there's an incompetence

2388
01:23:24,950 --> 01:23:23,600
or is it more of a sinister aspect to it

2389
01:23:27,110 --> 01:23:24,960
that certain things are deliberately

2390
01:23:29,030 --> 01:23:27,120
held back uh

2391
01:23:29,910 --> 01:23:29,040
probably both i'll be the first one to

2392
01:23:32,149 --> 01:23:29,920
tell you that a lot of the

2393
01:23:37,430 --> 01:23:32,159
documentations that we wrote for a tip

2394
01:23:40,790 --> 01:23:39,510
you know some of it is incompetence or

2395
01:23:42,149 --> 01:23:40,800
an aptitude because you're relying on

2396
01:23:43,350 --> 01:23:42,159
people to go through their files and

2397
01:23:45,110 --> 01:23:43,360
historic stuff and say do you have

2398
01:23:46,390 --> 01:23:45,120
anything related to this and you're

2399
01:23:47,590 --> 01:23:46,400
asking to drop what they're doing and

2400
01:23:49,030 --> 01:23:47,600
stop their work that they're doing that

2401
01:23:50,629 --> 01:23:49,040
they're getting paid for to go through

2402
01:23:52,790 --> 01:23:50,639
you know their their hard drive and by

2403
01:23:54,629 --> 01:23:52,800
the way people get hundreds of foia

2404
01:23:55,590 --> 01:23:54,639
requests a year so you know a lot of

2405
01:23:57,510 --> 01:23:55,600
times you're like yeah i don't know

2406
01:23:58,950 --> 01:23:57,520
anything like that no unresponsive and

2407
01:24:00,709 --> 01:23:58,960
you respond back i don't have anything

2408
01:24:02,470 --> 01:24:00,719
and the foia says okay because they

2409
01:24:03,590 --> 01:24:02,480
can't come in and search your computer

2410
01:24:04,790 --> 01:24:03,600
they're not going to sit there and so

2411
01:24:06,310 --> 01:24:04,800
they're just taking your word at face

2412
01:24:07,830 --> 01:24:06,320
value and you're like what man i got i'm

2413
01:24:09,430 --> 01:24:07,840
in the middle of writing a powerpoint

2414
01:24:11,189 --> 01:24:09,440
presentation for the boss i've got 30

2415
01:24:12,950 --> 01:24:11,199
minutes to get it done and now i've got

2416
01:24:14,550 --> 01:24:12,960
the foia request saying you need an

2417
01:24:15,750 --> 01:24:14,560
answer now well guess what i got nothing

2418
01:24:18,149 --> 01:24:15,760
to respond to

2419
01:24:20,870 --> 01:24:18,159
you know action passed action completed

2420
01:24:21,830 --> 01:24:20,880
um i'm not saying that that's right

2421
01:24:25,830 --> 01:24:21,840
but

2422
01:24:30,229 --> 01:24:28,550
question from jean is there one aspect

2423
01:24:36,550 --> 01:24:30,239
of the phenomenon that luff finds to be

2424
01:24:36,560 --> 01:24:42,070
wow gene um

2425
01:24:48,709 --> 01:24:44,870
i think

2426
01:24:50,950 --> 01:24:48,719
the phenomenon really doesn't concern

2427
01:24:53,189 --> 01:24:50,960
the phenomenon it involves

2428
01:24:55,830 --> 01:24:53,199
our own human nature

2429
01:24:57,990 --> 01:24:55,840
and how we turn against each other when

2430
01:25:00,550 --> 01:24:58,000
faced with

2431
01:25:01,910 --> 01:25:00,560
potentially information that is

2432
01:25:04,149 --> 01:25:01,920
existential

2433
01:25:05,750 --> 01:25:04,159
um

2434
01:25:08,149 --> 01:25:05,760
you know we're really we're fragile

2435
01:25:09,750 --> 01:25:08,159
species

2436
01:25:13,030 --> 01:25:09,760
emotionally

2437
01:25:16,310 --> 01:25:13,040
and anytime you you

2438
01:25:20,229 --> 01:25:17,590
beliefs

2439
01:25:24,310 --> 01:25:20,239
or the way that they view the universe

2440
01:25:25,110 --> 01:25:24,320
the very very first reaction is to to to

2441
01:25:27,270 --> 01:25:25,120
fight

2442
01:25:29,430 --> 01:25:27,280
you know and it's disbelief no no i'm

2443
01:25:31,750 --> 01:25:29,440
not wrong you're wrong

2444
01:25:34,149 --> 01:25:31,760
and um

2445
01:25:36,149 --> 01:25:34,159
you know we we have a hard time really

2446
01:25:38,310 --> 01:25:36,159
changing changing our views even in the

2447
01:25:40,470 --> 01:25:38,320
face of new evidence

2448
01:25:42,070 --> 01:25:40,480
we we would rather reject the evidence

2449
01:25:43,830 --> 01:25:42,080
in favor of our own preconceived

2450
01:25:47,030 --> 01:25:43,840
opinions

2451
01:25:49,430 --> 01:25:47,040
and that's problematic because because

2452
01:25:51,030 --> 01:25:49,440
real science doesn't work that way

2453
01:25:52,950 --> 01:25:51,040
real science is about constant

2454
01:25:55,430 --> 01:25:52,960
evaluation and re-evaluation of your

2455
01:25:56,870 --> 01:25:55,440
hypothesis and and testing this

2456
01:25:57,990 --> 01:25:56,880
hypothesis

2457
01:26:00,070 --> 01:25:58,000
um

2458
01:26:01,030 --> 01:26:00,080
and and being your own you know worst

2459
01:26:03,669 --> 01:26:01,040
critic

2460
01:26:05,669 --> 01:26:03,679
because that's that's how you find flaws

2461
01:26:08,149 --> 01:26:05,679
in theories and you have to be willing

2462
01:26:09,750 --> 01:26:08,159
to find flaws in your own theories you

2463
01:26:11,590 --> 01:26:09,760
have to you have to look in the mirror

2464
01:26:14,070 --> 01:26:11,600
you have to be able to do that

2465
01:26:16,070 --> 01:26:14,080
and this topic is you know it's so

2466
01:26:18,709 --> 01:26:16,080
mysterious and it has a potential for

2467
01:26:20,390 --> 01:26:18,719
our species in such a profound way

2468
01:26:22,950 --> 01:26:20,400
that there's a lot of people who just

2469
01:26:24,790 --> 01:26:22,960
can't even even conceive it they'd

2470
01:26:25,910 --> 01:26:24,800
rather spend their time

2471
01:26:27,669 --> 01:26:25,920
you know

2472
01:26:30,870 --> 01:26:27,679
watching keeping up with the kardashians

2473
01:26:33,110 --> 01:26:30,880
and again nothing wrong with that but

2474
01:26:34,709 --> 01:26:33,120
but when given a choice you know

2475
01:26:36,550 --> 01:26:34,719
do you want to have a conversation about

2476
01:26:38,229 --> 01:26:36,560
potentially something that is that is

2477
01:26:39,750 --> 01:26:38,239
relevant to our entire species and our

2478
01:26:41,910 --> 01:26:39,760
existence

2479
01:26:43,910 --> 01:26:41,920
um a lot of people you know going back

2480
01:26:45,350 --> 01:26:43,920
to the old cliche of the matrix movie

2481
01:26:46,629 --> 01:26:45,360
they they you know they'll they'll go

2482
01:26:47,990 --> 01:26:46,639
for that blue pill every time they think

2483
01:26:49,750 --> 01:26:48,000
they want the red pill but in reality

2484
01:26:51,590 --> 01:26:49,760
they don't they want the blue pill

2485
01:26:53,590 --> 01:26:51,600
they want to they want to remain

2486
01:26:55,430 --> 01:26:53,600
comfortable in their the little shiny

2487
01:26:57,590 --> 01:26:55,440
box that they've created for themselves

2488
01:26:59,590 --> 01:26:57,600
with limitations and boundaries and okay

2489
01:27:01,270 --> 01:26:59,600
this is where i am this is who i am and

2490
01:27:02,390 --> 01:27:01,280
this is where i fit

2491
01:27:03,750 --> 01:27:02,400
um

2492
01:27:06,709 --> 01:27:03,760
people are very uncomfortable with the

2493
01:27:08,390 --> 01:27:06,719
unknown um it's just it's just

2494
01:27:09,270 --> 01:27:08,400
the way we are as a species we don't

2495
01:27:10,870 --> 01:27:09,280
like

2496
01:27:11,830 --> 01:27:10,880
uh the unknown

2497
01:27:16,629 --> 01:27:11,840
and

2498
01:27:19,110 --> 01:27:16,639
important because

2499
01:27:20,310 --> 01:27:19,120
we expect them to have answers for us

2500
01:27:21,830 --> 01:27:20,320
and uh

2501
01:27:23,110 --> 01:27:21,840
and when they don't it makes us very

2502
01:27:24,870 --> 01:27:23,120
uncomfortable

2503
01:27:26,390 --> 01:27:24,880
and this is a topic where there's a lot

2504
01:27:27,669 --> 01:27:26,400
more questions and there are answers

2505
01:27:29,030 --> 01:27:27,679
right now and it makes a lot of people

2506
01:27:32,390 --> 01:27:29,040
uncomfortable so

2507
01:27:34,390 --> 01:27:32,400
you know they they tend to you know

2508
01:27:35,830 --> 01:27:34,400
focus on other things i guess

2509
01:27:37,990 --> 01:27:35,840
and by the way that's not a bad thing

2510
01:27:39,830 --> 01:27:38,000
it's not i'm not saying this to try to

2511
01:27:41,910 --> 01:27:39,840
make anyone feel terrible or make

2512
01:27:45,110 --> 01:27:41,920
anybody feel you know mad for not

2513
01:27:47,030 --> 01:27:45,120
considering this topic a serious topic

2514
01:27:49,350 --> 01:27:47,040
it's just the way we are as a species

2515
01:27:51,189 --> 01:27:49,360
you know we we don't like

2516
01:27:53,030 --> 01:27:51,199
we don't like unanswered questions and

2517
01:27:54,629 --> 01:27:53,040
it's probably an evolutionary thing

2518
01:27:56,070 --> 01:27:54,639
probably goes back to the

2519
01:27:57,990 --> 01:27:56,080
you know

2520
01:27:59,669 --> 01:27:58,000
our instinct of fight-or-flight because

2521
01:28:01,110 --> 01:27:59,679
something that is unknown something that

2522
01:28:03,110 --> 01:28:01,120
we don't recognize could be a potential

2523
01:28:05,910 --> 01:28:03,120
threat therefore we're afraid of it

2524
01:28:06,950 --> 01:28:05,920
right or we fight it one of the two

2525
01:28:08,790 --> 01:28:06,960
and so

2526
01:28:10,149 --> 01:28:08,800
so yeah there you have it that's i think

2527
01:28:12,149 --> 01:28:10,159
that's probably

2528
01:28:14,229 --> 01:28:12,159
the biggest fear i have regarding this

2529
01:28:17,189 --> 01:28:14,239
topic isn't the topic itself it's our

2530
01:28:19,189 --> 01:28:17,199
reaction to the topic

2531
01:28:20,550 --> 01:28:19,199
i've got two more listener questions

2532
01:28:22,790 --> 01:28:20,560
from michelle

2533
01:28:24,310 --> 01:28:22,800
are there sensors in use by the us

2534
01:28:26,390 --> 01:28:24,320
military that are tasked to be

2535
01:28:28,229 --> 01:28:26,400
specifically specifically track

2536
01:28:30,629 --> 01:28:28,239
anomalies signatures with parameters

2537
01:28:32,390 --> 01:28:30,639
guided by uap encounters

2538
01:28:34,070 --> 01:28:32,400
can't answer that question

2539
01:28:37,430 --> 01:28:34,080
great question michelle

2540
01:28:40,470 --> 01:28:37,440
i uh but unfortunately i i cannot uh we

2541
01:28:43,270 --> 01:28:40,480
have we have capabilities that certainly

2542
01:28:47,110 --> 01:28:43,280
have the technical capabilities to to to

2543
01:28:49,669 --> 01:28:47,120
to track uap uh but but are those

2544
01:28:53,590 --> 01:28:49,679
deliberately focusing on uab i cannot i

2545
01:28:59,030 --> 01:28:55,750
final question from mike how would your

2546
01:29:01,590 --> 01:28:59,040
family say you have changed since 2007

2547
01:29:03,110 --> 01:29:01,600
i.e before you started the a-tip

2548
01:29:04,390 --> 01:29:03,120
you know you'd have to ask them i

2549
01:29:05,350 --> 01:29:04,400
wouldn't want to answer for my family i

2550
01:29:07,110 --> 01:29:05,360
think they'd probably tell you i'm

2551
01:29:08,390 --> 01:29:07,120
exactly the same

2552
01:29:12,070 --> 01:29:08,400
i've always been

2553
01:29:14,070 --> 01:29:12,080
been lou elizondo not trying to be

2554
01:29:16,390 --> 01:29:14,080
anything or anybody else

2555
01:29:19,189 --> 01:29:16,400
um i've always approached

2556
01:29:20,870 --> 01:29:19,199
challenges the same way you know try try

2557
01:29:22,790 --> 01:29:20,880
to be open-minded try to be aware of my

2558
01:29:25,350 --> 01:29:22,800
own cognitive bias

2559
01:29:29,110 --> 01:29:25,360
when i can and try to keep it in check

2560
01:29:32,149 --> 01:29:29,120
um always be careful of of pride and ego

2561
01:29:33,189 --> 01:29:32,159
interfering with with the pursuit of of

2562
01:29:35,270 --> 01:29:33,199
truth

2563
01:29:37,110 --> 01:29:35,280
um

2564
01:29:39,510 --> 01:29:37,120
i don't think i've changed at all

2565
01:29:41,030 --> 01:29:39,520
you know i i've always kind of i think

2566
01:29:42,790 --> 01:29:41,040
been this way but again you'd have to

2567
01:29:44,390 --> 01:29:42,800
ask them because you know

2568
01:29:46,950 --> 01:29:44,400
the question is really how do they see

2569
01:29:48,629 --> 01:29:46,960
right and not how i do how do i see me

2570
01:29:50,550 --> 01:29:48,639
and those are two different things

2571
01:29:52,390 --> 01:29:50,560
um i suspect they would tell you that

2572
01:29:54,709 --> 01:29:52,400
but ultimately you know maybe maybe set

2573
01:29:57,110 --> 01:29:54,719
up an interview with

2574
01:29:58,709 --> 01:29:57,120
talk to my wife maybe talk to my kids

2575
01:30:01,430 --> 01:29:58,719
and ask them that question no problem

2576
01:30:03,110 --> 01:30:01,440
problem with you asking

2577
01:30:04,790 --> 01:30:03,120
i'd happily do that and i'm sure people

2578
01:30:06,229 --> 01:30:04,800
would like to hear from them as well if

2579
01:30:07,669 --> 01:30:06,239
they would happily get in front of a mic

2580
01:30:10,070 --> 01:30:07,679
and or camera

2581
01:30:12,070 --> 01:30:10,080
lou um our time is almost up and you've

2582
01:30:13,910 --> 01:30:12,080
mentioned that you're for for various

2583
01:30:15,510 --> 01:30:13,920
reasons going to be stepping away in the

2584
01:30:18,629 --> 01:30:15,520
near future from from these sorts of

2585
01:30:20,470 --> 01:30:18,639
appearances for an amount of time and i

2586
01:30:22,229 --> 01:30:20,480
would hope selfishly that's not for too

2587
01:30:23,990 --> 01:30:22,239
long but we don't know i just want to

2588
01:30:26,149 --> 01:30:24,000
give you the floor to finish the podcast

2589
01:30:29,030 --> 01:30:26,159
to speak to the audience and give some

2590
01:30:30,790 --> 01:30:29,040
final words on advice how you're feeling

2591
01:30:35,110 --> 01:30:30,800
and just you know what they can do going

2592
01:30:37,110 --> 01:30:35,120
forward well first of all andy and dan

2593
01:30:38,870 --> 01:30:37,120
let me let me thank you guys profoundly

2594
01:30:41,270 --> 01:30:38,880
for for the service you're providing for

2595
01:30:43,189 --> 01:30:41,280
the for the rest of us chickens um it's

2596
01:30:45,270 --> 01:30:43,199
very very appreciated

2597
01:30:47,030 --> 01:30:45,280
and of course to your audience

2598
01:30:49,830 --> 01:30:47,040
for taking the time

2599
01:30:51,510 --> 01:30:49,840
to spend with us here today and and

2600
01:30:53,189 --> 01:30:51,520
and listen um

2601
01:30:55,189 --> 01:30:53,199
know this

2602
01:30:57,189 --> 01:30:55,199
um

2603
01:30:58,229 --> 01:30:57,199
you are the most important piece to this

2604
01:30:59,990 --> 01:30:58,239
equation

2605
01:31:02,229 --> 01:31:00,000
every single one of you in the audience

2606
01:31:03,350 --> 01:31:02,239
it's not me it's not andy it's not dan

2607
01:31:04,229 --> 01:31:03,360
it's you

2608
01:31:05,590 --> 01:31:04,239
um

2609
01:31:06,950 --> 01:31:05,600
we're doing this for you because

2610
01:31:08,310 --> 01:31:06,960
ultimately you're gonna have to make a

2611
01:31:09,990 --> 01:31:08,320
decision

2612
01:31:12,310 --> 01:31:10,000
not me

2613
01:31:14,149 --> 01:31:12,320
uh and that decision is is this topic

2614
01:31:17,270 --> 01:31:14,159
important enough that we need to

2615
01:31:18,629 --> 01:31:17,280
continue to pursue this as a species

2616
01:31:21,189 --> 01:31:18,639
maybe it's not

2617
01:31:25,430 --> 01:31:21,199
that's not up to me

2618
01:31:27,510 --> 01:31:25,440
that responsibility falls in in your lab

2619
01:31:30,149 --> 01:31:27,520
and so

2620
01:31:33,510 --> 01:31:30,159
i hope that that you continue this

2621
01:31:35,590 --> 01:31:33,520
pioneering spirit of asking questions

2622
01:31:37,750 --> 01:31:35,600
uh to include even asking me and

2623
01:31:39,430 --> 01:31:37,760
challenging me

2624
01:31:42,550 --> 01:31:39,440
i think i think it's

2625
01:31:44,709 --> 01:31:42,560
it's important because ultimately

2626
01:31:46,950 --> 01:31:44,719
ultimately you deserve the answers

2627
01:31:49,669 --> 01:31:46,960
whatever those answers are i think i

2628
01:31:52,950 --> 01:31:49,679
think you deserve those answers

2629
01:31:54,149 --> 01:31:52,960
and i guess as far as my my advice is

2630
01:31:55,910 --> 01:31:54,159
you know don't

2631
01:31:57,590 --> 01:31:55,920
don't stop asking the questions be

2632
01:32:00,070 --> 01:31:57,600
fearless in your pursuit of the truth

2633
01:32:01,590 --> 01:32:00,080
wherever that truth may lie

2634
01:32:05,750 --> 01:32:01,600
um

2635
01:32:08,790 --> 01:32:05,760
because ultimately you know it's it's

2636
01:32:10,310 --> 01:32:08,800
it it's for you

2637
01:32:12,149 --> 01:32:10,320
you deserve it

2638
01:32:13,189 --> 01:32:12,159
don't let other people make up make a

2639
01:32:14,709 --> 01:32:13,199
decision

2640
01:32:17,270 --> 01:32:14,719
on your behalf

2641
01:32:20,390 --> 01:32:17,280
whether or not you deserve information

2642
01:32:22,149 --> 01:32:20,400
that those days are over you know

2643
01:32:24,070 --> 01:32:22,159
you now have the ability and the power

2644
01:32:26,950 --> 01:32:24,080
in your hands to to to make that

2645
01:32:30,390 --> 01:32:26,960
decision yourself i wouldn't be so quick

2646
01:32:31,910 --> 01:32:30,400
to to to obfuscate that or or just give

2647
01:32:34,629 --> 01:32:31,920
it away to anybody else because that's

2648
01:32:38,870 --> 01:32:36,310
so i guess that's

2649
01:32:40,870 --> 01:32:38,880
that would be my advice to to to anybody

2650
01:32:42,149 --> 01:32:40,880
in the audience who

2651
01:32:44,870 --> 01:32:42,159
who wants

2652
01:32:48,229 --> 01:32:46,310
what my what my

2653
01:32:50,470 --> 01:32:48,239
what my uh

2654
01:32:51,990 --> 01:32:50,480
what my position is and what my advice

2655
01:32:54,070 --> 01:32:52,000
to you is

2656
01:32:56,070 --> 01:32:54,080
that is all for this week's show thank

2657
01:32:58,229 --> 01:32:56,080
you very much for listening please

2658
01:33:00,709 --> 01:32:58,239
remember to leave the podcast review on

2659
01:33:03,030 --> 01:33:00,719
your chosen platform you can like

2660
01:33:04,950 --> 01:33:03,040
retweet and subscribe that would all be

2661
01:33:07,110 --> 01:33:04,960
very much appreciated the shows are

2662
01:33:08,629 --> 01:33:07,120
being uploaded onto youtube as we speak

2663
01:33:11,110 --> 01:33:08,639
more and more you can sign up at

2664
01:33:13,830 --> 01:33:11,120
patreon.com forward slash that ufo

2665
01:33:16,070 --> 01:33:13,840
podcast to access shows ad free as well

2666
01:33:18,870 --> 01:33:16,080
please get in touch on twitter facebook

2667
01:33:22,550 --> 01:33:18,880
instagram that ufo podcast of course on

2668
01:33:24,550 --> 01:33:22,560
twitter it's at ufo uap am and again

2669
01:33:27,250 --> 01:33:24,560
folks as always keep looking up you

2670
01:33:47,669 --> 01:33:27,260
never know what you might see

2671
01:33:47,679 --> 01:33:54,370
is

2672
01:33:54,380 --> 01:34:03,350
[Music]

2673
01:34:17,020 --> 01:34:04,790
i can't imagine how it could have been

2674
01:34:17,030 --> 01:34:24,149
[Music]

2675
01:34:27,110 --> 01:34:25,430
there was something on my head and

2676
01:34:28,870 --> 01:34:27,120
everything was weird and everything was

2677
01:34:30,229 --> 01:34:28,880
red i helped out my boys they thought

2678
01:34:37,960 --> 01:34:30,239
this was nice they thought it was a

2679
01:34:52,709 --> 01:34:44,870
[Music]

2680
01:34:52,719 --> 01:34:57,930
what's that

2681
01:35:25,510 --> 01:35:02,550
[Music]

2682
01:35:32,870 --> 01:35:26,950
is

2683
01:35:34,709 --> 01:35:32,880
[Music]

2684
01:35:45,850 --> 01:35:34,719
it wasn't a tic tac and not quite a

2685
01:36:21,669 --> 01:36:06,480
[Music]

2686
01:36:21,679 --> 01:36:26,480
yes